Joel Stein, who wrote the now-infamous "I don’t support the troops" column for the Los Angeles Times, appeared on Hugh Hewitt’s show yesterday. Hewitt sliced him to ribbons:
HH: Let me ask you a tough question, Joel, because this is the toughest one. J.P. Blecksmith was a young Marine lieutenant, graduated from Annapolis, killed in Fallujah on November 11th, 2004. Just a tremendous human being and man. If you meet his parents on the street, what do you say to them?JS: That I’m so, so sorry.
HH: Do you honor the service that their son did?
JS: To honor the service their son…now this is a dumb question, but what do you mean by honor? That’s a word you keep using. I’m not entirely…maybe that’s my problem. But I’m not entirely sure what you’re…
HH: Honor usually means gratitude and esteem.
Very coherent, Joel. Well done. And props to Hewitt for not adding the obvious "you dumbass" to the end of that last remark.
Here’s the whole transcript and the audio.
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I happen to agree with Joel Stein’s main thrust:
“Folks who don’t support the troops, shouldn’t have ‘I support the troops’ bumper stickers.”
Of course, he tries to equivocate that you can pick and choose WHEN to support and not support the troops, as if they are different people when they’re in different places. He is too ignorant to realize that troops aren’t numbers or machines.
His piece should’ve been called, “A Tribute to Ignorance and Hypocrisy.” He tried to point out the hypocrisy of the statement “I support the troops, but I oppose the war,” as if you can divide the two.
I’ll loan him a clue: It’s either both, or neither. The troops are the army, are the mission, are the force for freedom in the world.
“Throughout history it has been the inaction of those who could have acted, the indifference of those who should have known better, the silence of the voice of justice when it mattered most, that has made it possible for evil to triumph.” Haile Selassie, Oct 1963
Congrats, Joel. You’ve come down firmly on the side of evil as has that rag, the LA Times. Bird cage owners, puppy trainers, and fish markets throughout the LA area thank you for your service.
I really doubt that people who don’t support the war have ’support the troops’ stickers. Most people that say they support the troops are just lying about that to make it seem they are not callous. These are the same people that would spit on the troops.. they just don’t want to appear that way. Its all about appearance.
Joel is amazingly ignorant and shows just how the social elite are. It was a beautiful interview.
My post to Rahman on this subject yesterday remains unanswered.
It is quite obvious from this interview that Stein’s position was not well thought out and basically indefensible.
If you really want a glimpse of him, check out his website: http://www.thejoelstein.com/
If you want a better idea of what a REAL “humorist” is like, read what James Lileks wrote about him: http://www.lileks.com/bleats/archive/06/0106/012506.html
What a jerk. This is the same type of class of person that thinks GWB is stooopid and never should have been elected President.
Jimb, to be a liberal, you have to dispense with logic and reason…ergo, to liberals can write nonsense and be perfectly credible to other liberals. That’s why they are so easily identified to normal people.
Ree-C, if you go back and look at published news stories from 1861 to 1865, they said Lincoln was stupid too. Of course, then stupid Lincoln now has the largest monument on the Mall.
I completely agree with Stein. Completely. This war has been complete bullshit from the very start. The President lied, the vice president lied, there was never any reason to invade Iraq, and the entire thing has become an ugly disaster. Anyone- any FOOL- who signs up to be part of this travesty is a murderous monster who deserves what they get.
By the way- I’ll stick up for my beliefs. Because I don’t believe in this war, I WON’T enlist and I won’t send my children to fight. How about you? You believe in this war? Prove it by signing your butt up or sending your babies to Iraq! You patsies.
Gurldogg, we would ordinarily delete comments like yours because of your potty mouth. Instead, I’m going to leave it up as an example of the left’s finest.
Ladies and gentlemen, this is the opposition. We might as well take the rest of the week off.
Good. Please leave it up.
By the way “Zilla,” you didn’t answer my question. Do you support the war so much that you’re willing to fight? Or are you a coward who only talks big? The kind of person that Stein was talking about?
Gurldogg, I see you’ve gone for the always popular chickenhawk argument. Here are a few reasons it doesn’t work:
1. It relies on an ad hominem circumstantial attack on yours truly. Not only is that not nice, it’s a logical fallacy that seriously weakens your position.
2. You appear to be arguing that only members of the military are qualified to form foreign policy opinions. Yet the constitution plainly subordinates the military to citizen leadership.
And I have a few questions to better understand your argument:
1. If war vets are the only ones who can support war, why aren’t they the only ones who can oppose it?
2. Do you extend this standard into other policy areas as well? Are only women allowed to have an opinion on abortion? Are only medical researchers allowed to have an opinion on human embryo research?
3. A large majority of the American public (including women, old folks, open homosexuals, children, the sick and disabled) are ineligible for combat. Are any of these people allowed to have a pro-war opinion, or must their thoughts be policed?
Gurddog, why all the vitriolic verbage? If you hate the U.S. so much, why are you still here? There is Canada, Mexico, France, Germany. I am sick of folks who slam the US. MOVE! See how much freedoms you have in the middle east. Go suck up to the terrorists! Your comments are pathetic, my friend.
Sorry, Matt, I shouldn’t even have commented. My bad! DOTI
Way to keep your cool, Matt. You would have booted me off LST for good if I had pressed the submit button about an hour ago. Thankfully, I deleted it first.
Do they pay you enough here to put up with all this?
Cameraguy, the salary isn’t the best, but I get unlimited use of LST One, our corporate jet.
What no hat tip? I linked Hewitt’s interview last nite on the original story comments.
Just kidding, I love Hugh Hewitt, he so gracefully takes these people apart.
As for Joel Stein, like most liberals all you have to do is let them speak. They consistently prove how foolish they are.
Gurldogg, I believe in this war and have even seen my husband sent off to Iraq. He is truly my hero because despite the fact that you view him as a “murderous monster” he will still fight for your freedom.
Zilla and others,
If the chickenhawk argument is “always popular” there must be some truth to it.
When I support something, I’m actively working for it. I support my wife, and I work to keep our relationship healthy. I support low income housing, and I make my living by building it. When people supported WWI, they enlisted. Same with WWII. Same with Vietnam. I don’t support this awful war, and I’m not going anywhere near it. With the possible exception of Erika, I don’t see that any of you “support” the war in any way other than prowling right wing websites and hurling comments at people who disagree with you. That’s no kind of support at all. That’s what we call “lip service.” And the people who offer it? We call them “chicken hawks.” If the shoe fits, you gotta wear it.
If all you people really supported the war as much as you claim, maybe the armed forces wouldn’t be having so much trouble meeting its recruitment goals.
I think Joel Stein is more honest than any of you armchair patriots.
Sigh. Time to put on a clinic.
Gurldogg, are you trying to hit every logical fallacy in the book? For those you scoring at home, that fallacy was an Appeal to Common Practice. You see, just because many people do something (make stupid arguments, beat their wives, smoke crack) doesn’t make it justified.
You failed to address my question #3. Are women, homosexuals, children and the disabled allowed to support the war, though they’re prohibited from fighting it? Or are they “armchair patriots?”
Lone Star Times counts among its readers many soldiers and families of soldiers. In addition, we’ve made significant efforts to help the troops in a tangible fashion, both individually and collectively. My little brother will likely be deployed to Iraq this summer. If you’re suggesting that the war hasn’t hit home, you’re sorely mistaken.
Um, you came here, remember? When I go out “prowling” for someone to dismantle, I pick a tougher target.
The Army has met its recruiting goals for seven consecutive months.
Cool! You started and ended your screed with a logical fallacy! This time, it was something between the good ol’ Red Herring and Straw Man. None of the commenters claimed Stein was dishonest. Regardless, his forthright statement — “I don’t support the troops” doesn’t logically lead to “supporting the troops is wrong.”
You failed to address my question #3. Are women, homosexuals, children and the disabled allowed to support the war, though they’re prohibited from fighting it? Or are they “armchair patriots?”
They can support it in any number of ways. Children can send cards and letters to soldiers. The disabled can work as computer technicians for the military. Homosexuals can join the service, just as they’ve always done. But calling the MSM names doesn’t qualify as support from those people any more than it does from able bodied men who are of fighting age.
By the way, which of the above categories are you claiming that you fall into?
None of this changes the fact that this war will end in nothing but tragedy for the U.S., for the Iraqis and for the world. No amount of faith in a lie will change that. And no matter how many liberals you smear, it won’t change the fact that the Iraqi campaign is morally bankrupt. I’m sorry for you if your little brother becomes the next soldier to die in a war that never had to happen. This war sucks.
Your concern rings just a bit insincere, since you called him a “FOOL” and a “murderous monster.”
Now I’m done with you. As Churchill said, any more and I’d just be making the rubble bounce.
I suspect that gurldogg and feagan are one.
rj
Was anyone else, after being appalled at Stein’s remarks, actually a little refreshed at his honesty? I dunno, just kinda stood out to me.
And I would just like to take the “Chickenhawk” argument to its logical conclusion; if only those who enlist have the right to have a say in our nation’s foreign policy, are you prepared for a nation where suffrage is restricted to only vets and those currently serving (anyone read Starship Troopers)? Given that those in the armed forces voted for Bush by a margin of over 3 to 1, I suspect not.