There is a movie that is coming out soon that EVERY American NEEDS to see. They need to see it over and over again. I am of course speaking of United 93. There are those that claim it is "too soon" to show something like this. They are laying the groundwork NOW in order to complain about it after it is released. They would like you to forget that 9-11 happened, or that somehow the United States DESERVED it.
Well if it is too soon for that, I guess it is too soon to show this too.
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I wonder if the movie shows the plane being shot down.
Still too vivid.
I’m curious - does EVERY American NEED to see this because:
1) We must all remember the sacrifices and bravery of the people on board who fought back in order to save others from a similar fate; or,
2) It feeds into a primal fear that is useful to maintain the collective will of this country, which otherwise is slipping quickly, to continue to fight wars overseas that may or may not have anything to do with 9/11?
You tell me.
What is wrong with being angry? 300+ people died and we don’t have the right to be angry? People are kidnapped and beheaded and e aon’t have the right to be angry? They can’t show us the images of people jumping from windows instead of burning to death, or video of kidnapping victims pleading for their lives before a knife is drawn across their throat silencing them forever. A head being held up for us to see as a peaceful mooslim shouts allah akbar….
BENZION ADDS– WARNING, GRAPHIC VIDEO.
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/video/johnson-murder.wmv
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/video/korean2.wmv
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/video/armstrong-murder2.wmv
fasternu– I’ll let the links stay, since I understand and share the sentiment… but everyone, let’s not make posting these sorts of links a regular thing, OK?
I do think it’s appropriate to remember who we’re fighting, but I don’t want to make these clips so frequent they become routine.
Thanks all for your understanding.
Seriously, I was at the theatre the other day and the trailer came on. It made me very uncomfortable and I thought it was completely inappropriate.
We need to be reminded of our enemy! We fight them there so it doesn’t happen here! They hate us!!! They want to kill us! Their world is divided into muslim and onon muslim. We live in non muslim or tha land of war they call it! They are at war with us (non muslims) because we do not accept their religion. Yet we are called the racists and we are the violent ones!!
#5
Shakey, We are at war!! Killing Americans is inappropriate!
#7 fasty
So it can be simplified to Muslim vs. non-Muslim? You’re kidding, right?
#3 Bobby Warren
The film was made by Universal Pictures to make
money and now Bush is in bed with Hollywood to
keep the war going? What planet are you from?
Hey, guys. Don’t assume everyone who is saying “too soon” is doing so because they sympathize with the enemy or want everyone to forget the attacks. That’s a very broad generalization.
I live in New York. The people I know who don’t want to see this movie either lost someone in the attacks, had traumatic days of thinking they lost someone or just had several days in fear wondering if there were going to be more attacks. Just seeing the trailer brought a lot of that back.
I know the families involved have given the movie their blessing, but that doesn’t mean everyone directly impacted is ready to relive that day on the big screen. I’m not saying the movie shouldn’t have been made or shouldn’t be shown. I’m just saying don’t automatically dismiss those of us who aren’t ready to see it as anti-American.
#10 mike78 - very, very well said.
Dear Smacktle
Here are some other movies that showed war and death made for money
Band of Brothers
The Green Berets
The Alamo
Saving Private Ryan
Pork Chop Hill
Pearl Harbor
Guadacanal
The Battle of the Buldge
Patton
D-Day the Sixth of June
The Sullivan Brothers
Midway
to me, excuse me if we differ, United 93’s last moments were in the finest traditions and memories of this great nation made by ordinary people in an extraordinary moment who chose certain death rather than let some dangerous people kill others - I am not uncomfortable nor ashamed to see it - wish you were too
#8
Shakey
No. I’m not.. It is that simple….They chose this. It is their radical belief:
“Dar al-Islam
Dar al-Islam (Arabic: دار الإسلام literally house of submission) is a term used to refer to those lands under Muslim government(s). In the conservative tradition of Islam the world is divided into two components: dar al-Islam, the house of submission and dar al-Harb, the house of war.”
They are at war with us… they just started the shooting part of it…..
Here is how I reacted when I saw the trailer, I misted up and felt tears coming to my eyes, My cheeks flushed, I got ANGRY.
I understand that there are a lot of people who lost their friends and loved ones that day, but do we do them justice by trying not to think about it? Are we doing ourselves a favor in running from reality? No we are not. Grief has the ability to warp us badly. Just take a look at Sheehan for an excellent example of what grief can do. She is pissing on her own son’s grave to feed her warped sense of right and wrong.
Just as when a warped peice of steel from being heat treated has to be bent back into proper shape, so must we be bent back into shape after being subjected to the searing flame of grief. Running from the pain does not diminish the pain. The only way to overcome it is to face it and feel it and allow it to cleanse us of our grief. Only then can we think upon our friend’s and loved one’s sacrifices and feel proud of thier actions instead of feeling the pain of loss only.
#12
Well said, and I agree with you.
Smacktle and Headshaker
You both have had fun enjoying your rights given by God and blood to bluntly give your views, make accusations and generally show the entire world what?
Now if our president was wanting to make the 9/11 a political issue all he had to do is this
Before the next press conference
GWB: Thank you all for coming, everyone will get a chance to ask a question tonight no matter what the time contrainsts but first we have a 30 second film to show you and the nation:
cut to towers
First Plane Hits
Second Plane Hits
Cut to burning mother of three jumping from 106th story
cut to black hear radio transmisions
Ladder 43 come in
43 here
Building coming down status
43 has reached its post
Evac 43
43 in on station
43 out
Hey, a colleague of mine, reading over my shoulder, said we ought to be showing the movie “The Alamo” over and over.
Terrorism at its finest. Remember it always. I need no movie to fire the anger. It never has left me. Had I been president, Tora Bora would have been hit with an H-bomb. This earth has not seen the imperialism I would have expressed. Lucky world. Lucky terrorist/murderers. Iran would be a nice glass desert and ALL STATES that support terrorist activities would be afraid forever. I would have spoken to the Saudi Royals and told them if it happens any more, Mecca would be next.
Hate them. I have seen death. One goes on. What other choice does one have? Hollywood disgusts me even more than Washington DC or the girly-men in Austin. Prostitution of body, mind and soul is become the norm. Compromise ans surrender are elevated to noblity. I would rather be dead than one of THEM.
#17 I agree.
#12 Eric Johnson
Did you read my post?
First I want you to read #3 Bobby Warrens post.
Then click on his name, it takes you to a website.
Read some of his stuff there. Then go back and
read my post. Your so angry about one post I
made that you got blinders on. WAKE UP!
While WWII was still being fought, Hollywood made movies about the war. It showed the heroics of Americans fighting for our freedoms and our way of life. Those movies bolstered patriotism and comforted family members of the men fighting and dying with the knowledge that they were fighting for a real cause. That was when Hollywood was at its finest.
Now, Hollywood makes a film that shows the heroism of the men and women on Flight 93. It is a film that met the approval of the families of those lost. The production company is even donating 10% of the GROSS from opening weekend to the Flight 93 Memorial. It is a film illustrating the dangers we face from blood thirsty terrorists in our everyday lives. It shows what our GI’s are fighting to protect us from, and we question whether or not it’s too soon?
It’s not soon enough.
as you may or may not know, this movie has already be done and shown to the public; and for free. about 6 month’s ago, i believe A+E made a tv version of this and advertised it on other channels besides just A+E.
so, why everyone is upset; i dont know as you have to pay to see it; so those who do see it made the choice to do it. if it bothers them, it was their own fault.
the gay cowboy movie and its ads on cable for the dvd, sin city, micheal moore’s movies and many others bothered me; but i have to live with the truth that these are parts of America. why should others be exempt if we are living in a free society ?
If it’s too soon for some people to watch the movie
then don’t watch it!
#17 Buddy, what we need now is a movie about the Mexican’s massacre of Fannin and his men at Goliad. Shakey, would that be okay? Or is it too soon?
Sticking your head in the sand won’t make the muslim enemy go away. The only thing wrong with the movie is it should have been released closer to an election so that Americans would remember which candidates are for appeasement and which are for enagaement of the enemy and vote accordingly.
#18
You stated what I’m certain the vast majority of Americans actually feel themselves, but can’t say aloud because of the fear of reprisals and retribution from the vocal left.
That movie is BS. Charlie Sheen said it was government planes that were enlisted to hit the bldgs and the towers were imploded to fall when the time was right.If anyone would know its gotta be Charley. As far as the plane that crashed in PA. I dont recall seeing any plane parts lying around. Just a hole with papers flying around. Hmmm.This is all about GWB and HALLIBURTON wanting to control the oil fields and make us slaves. The real planes and people are probably on some uncharted island somewhere in the Pacific Ocean makes me think of this.
Seeing these images still makes my stomach jump. I still can feel the absolute astonishment as I heard the reporter say “Oh My God there is another plane.” Everyone felt the same horror that day.
I see these images and I remember, and it makes me sad. While I do not think we should forget or that these images should be hidden away, I do not think now is the time for Hollywood to “Pearl Harbor” this event. I watch the television specials every year on the anniversary, but I don’t think I can stomach lining some liberal elitest hollywood types pockets when the movie comes out.
God Bless America. We must not forget. We must remember no matter how painful it is so that we do not let this happen again. And yes, perhaps it does play to the fears of this country to show these images. But I’d rather be fearful and dilligent than happy and complacent and open to attack.
That’s the great thing about living in America. We have choices. People in the theocratic Islamic nations don’t. Exercise your right. If you feel the movie about the savage attack on America and it’s civilian population is too much for you, then don’t go to the movie. If you really feel that it just lines the pockets of westcoast liberal elitists then don’t go. Also don’t go see the Harry Potter films or rent the DVD’s if it is a economic boycott that you are perpatrating.
But, please do not try to impede the people that want to go see it.
Personnaly I’ll wait till it hits DVD.
Smacktle clearly didn’t read my post. If he had, he would realize I wasn’t criticizing the movie, but rather the use of 9/11 as a bully pulpit for political gain.
I never said anything about Bush being in bed with Hollywood. I never said the movie was made for political reasons. If you’ll look at the first line in my post, and then compare it with the original blog entry, maybe you’ll see the point - Rorschach is clearly politicizing the movie.
Bobby, Rorschach stated some simple truths. How is that politicizing the movie? Are you saying that Rorschach’s observations are without merit?
Your observation (2) in your post #3 might indeed be correct, but it also might be necessary. A primal fear of the horrors of Islam should be ingrained on all of us. Islam is a danger to our way of life. I don’t apologize for those views. They are justified. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to take their family and go live under Islam for an extended length of time. Then come back and tell me if I’m wrong. And no, I haven’t lived under Islam. I also didn’t live under the tyranny of Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, or the Communist Soviet Union. I need to merely apply common sense and logic….two things that will not be found in liberal thought processes.
#30 Bobby Warren
You never said that, but you insinuated it IMO.
Your #2 above is clear conjecture. Next you will
give me polls from somewhere as proof. Nice spin.
You are clearly a Democrat/ Liberal by reading
your blog. Good luck with your Chris Bell
campaign lol
Smack, the libs still don’t quite understand it’s not a war on Bin Ladin, it’s a WAR ON TERROR. Saddam aided and abetted terrorists on several fronts. Saddam was a WMD in his own country (400,000 dead in mass graves attest to that). Today’s libs would have blamed our embargo on Japan for Pearl Harbor. Any excuse to cut and run will do for them. Fortunately, we have a sufficient number of Americans who believe otherwise. Remember, during the American Revolution, 1/3 of Americans supported the Revolution, 1/3 were for England, and 1/3 didn’t care one way or the other. Liberals remind me alot of John Kerry and Benedict Arnold…..they were for the war before they were against it.
I would like to see this movie, and no, I don’t think it’s too soon. I have read this book and would recommend it to anyone who wants a factual look at the people involved in United Flight 93. Regardless of the political affiliation of anyone on that plane, their stories need to be told sooner rather than later.
If it’s a War on Terror, WHERE ARE ALL THE TERRORIST ATTACKS? Geez, you would think that with our wide open borders, if TERROR was the primary goal we’d be seeing continual attacks.
IT’S ALL BULLSH**!
Smacktle
I’m not angry, just calling you out - sorry if I actually read your post- besides all of your posts kind of add up don’t you think?
Republicans connecting the dots
#35 - come on shakey, wake up! There are no terrorist attacks here (there have been many elsewhere) because we’ve seriously hindered their ability to terrorize! You have got to take off your Bush Blinders and look at the world objectively once in a while. Whatever you may think of Bush, there’s a reason we haven’t been attacked at home yet, in spite of the Victicrats insistence we treat this war as a law enforcement action, and it has everything to do with his leadership on this issue.
And you can bet your last dollar if this was a George Clooney movie (that would of course show that the attacks of 9/11 were America’s fault) the Victicrats, Hollywood and the DLWM would be fawning all over themselves supporting the movie. Disgusting double standard!
The whole thing doesn’t sit well with me. But #29, I don’t have any power or control over whether or not the movie is made or isn’t made. I’m not trying to impose on anyones rights to do anything, just stating my views.
Passion of the Christ didn’t sit well with me either, but I felt it was an important thing, so I went. The same feelings will probably compell me to see Flight 93. I hope what an earlier poster wrote about 10% of the gross going to the Flight 93 memorial is true. If that’s the case, I’ll see the movie a dozen times and hope its a blockbuster. Just so more money goes to that cause. I don’t know enough about the director or the producers to know if they are trying to help honor those that died, or if they are merely trying to make a buck. I hope its the former.
But you can’t blame those of us that are emotionally not ready to relive some of these moments on the big screen. And truthfully, I don’t know if I’d ever be ready. And the movies listed previously, Saving Private Ryan especially, are still hard for me to watch. But those are important films to see, no matter how hard to watch. If this turns out to be one such film (I haven’t even seen a trailor, only heard/read the hype)I will be in line to buy a ticket.
Many terrorists are now in heaven with Allah, the rest are reading their “to kill instuctions” from Osama in a big dark cave in the middle of nowhere, protecting their arses.
#37
If Clooney had written the movie:
Murder on Flight 93
The story of innocent muslim travellers assaulted by white angry conservatives. The weary travellers fought their way into the cabin to protect themselves from the angry white conservatives. Once in the cabin, the Two angry white conservative pilots felt no pity and also attacked them. The poor travellers fended off the agression and took control of the plane. However, the insufficient flight training they had (because their skin color and religion would not allow them to learn to fly properly) was not enough to fly the large commercial airliner. The travellers bravely tried to keep the plane aloft and then lost control. They attempted to safely land the plane in a field, but their prro training lead to an accident where the plane crashed.
#36 Eric
Thank you for reading my posts.
#37 LOL Hammie you should submit your resume for White House Spokesperson.
I hope you’re not that naive. Terrorists can strike at us anytime they want. Look at Israel; as much security/fences/soldiers/etc. they have, they can NEVER stop it 100%.
If a radical idiot wanted to blow up a bus in the United States, it can be done almost at will.
It’s never happened. Since 9/11, we attacked Afghanistan, we took out Saddam and have occupied Iraq, we support Israel more than any other ally…BUT IT’S NEVER HAPPENED! And you think it’s because of Bush’s leadership? It has nothing to do with Bush, or anyone else for that matter, because the goal of 9/11 was not terror.
You wonder why I shake my head™
#42 - No offense Shakey, but your being a bonehead (on this issue). Your hatred of GWB has become as blind as the vitriolic Victicrats’. You blame him for EVERYTHING that goes wrong and give him credit for NOTHING that goes right. You wonder why people think you’re a liberal™ (YWWPTYAL™).
#35 Shakey is a classic example of the dangers of sitting out the next election because you are angry at Republicans and their issues. With enough pressure, we can correct the GOP, or replace them. With Democrats in power, the “shakey” thought processes of the left will leave us vulnerable to future attacks.
It’s kind of interesting how we we attacked Afghanistan, we took out Saddam and have occupied Iraq and have had no terrorism attacks on our soil.
The terrorist haven’t had time to blow up busses in
the US, because they have been either running away, hiding or going to Iraq. Your logic is
really strange on this post.
because the goal of 9/11 was not terror.
You mean they really didn’t mean to do it?
hamous your right about the airplanes, that is how
it is going to end. I’m seeing them everywhere!
#38 StacyE, click on the link, it takes you to the trailer, then you can decide for yourself.
#35;
I’ve watched, for quite some time, the post that appear from time to time on LST’s.
Yours are probably the most interestingly consistent.
You deny the obvious, and reject the truth.
Your post #35 being the base of my opinion.
You question “if it is a war on terriost” then say “where are the terriost”?
We have fire ants, but ignore them until they bite us. After bitten we wage a chemical war against them until we are satisified with our efforts.
The Jurist in the OJ trial had a train load of evidence to convict him, but did not.
We have 3000 +/- deaths on 9/11 and graphic pictures illustrating their horrific deaths (evidence); and you still question the motives for being in Iraq?
Liberals defy all logic, and that is no BULLS*#t, IMHO.
rj
Headshaker
I disagree, Bush took the lead and invaded two Arab countries and has significant forces at ready surrounding Syria, Saudi Arabia and Iran. It is real obvious that Saudi Arabia got the mesage and has killed 500+ Al Qaeda Terrorists as well as jailed several dozen Mullahs spewing really hateful stuff - i hear it on the radio every friday morning from the huge Mekkah and Jeddah stations I live just a few dozen miles away from them. These guys were broadcasting last summer - have you killed an American Today etc - now they’re silent - its more braodcasting the traditional Pillars of Islam messages Faith, Loyalty Charity etc - the jihad is over - not due to Clinton - due to direct action by Bush
what do you think the Taliban and Saddam were going to do in five years if Bush did the Kerry in the sand routine? How about sinking a carnival cruise line - yep that was one plan or a huge attack on LAX machine gunning hundreds of Citizens
All of a sudden Qatar and the UAE and even Kuwait and Oman are buying US made weapons and being strong allies - this never happened before
Thousands of terrorists are dead, thousands more rounded up
seems like its working, sounds like leadership
I am real interested in what you would do
BTW - how many bombings has there been since the wall went up in Israel?
France and Germany have barricades, check points, why all the fear and fuss - its normal to protet and define your borders
#42 headshaker
We’re in Iraq and that’s where the terrorism is. Were we not in Iraq and Afghanistan, your side (and you’re definitely in the BDS crowd on this issue) would be complaining about the terrorist attacks here in the US. “Dubya is letting them murder us.”
Those of you who are so deranged by Bush being president, you will criticize any action he takes, or any consequences from his actions or inactions. In other words, you’ll find fault no matter what.
I’m just happy he chose to have fault found for taking the fight to our enemies, rather than letting you find fault for his not preventing it.
I’ve never disagreed with you this strongly on any issue in the years since we’ve been posting on LST. You are the one unable to take an objective view in this instance.
#43 Hammie
This goes back before Bush, before Clinton, etc. It has nothing to do with hatred for Bush. If a Democrat were in office I’d be saying the same things (nice try though Big).
If someone can give me a valid reason why we did not see multiple attacks BEFORE 9/11 and AFTER 9/11, please, enlighten me and change my mind.
If you can honestly say that you believe we aren’t being attacked because of Bush’s leadership, then you deserve what you’re getting these days and in the days to come.
Here’s a look for those of us that have not seen the trailer.
It is not, repeat, not too soon for this to movie to be seen by all Americans. Especially since I hear it has gotten the ok from the families involved. The events of that day are burned into my memory and are as vivid today as it was on 9/11/01. I WILL NEVER FORGET. Some of you have met me and know I’m a good size ole boy and to this day I still weep for my country’s pain and loss of innocent life on that day combined with the anger at cowardly murderers who want to kill us all. They do not care if you are white, black, brown, Republican, democRat.
The DLM and DEMwitS don’t want us to remember September 11, 2001 and the War that was begun by Islam on that day. And yes, I refuse to say Radical Islam until the peaceful ones, if there are any, stand with us and remove these mudering skum from the earth.
Yes it will be difficult for many of us to view this movie as it is the news reports and reaccounts we see not near enough today. However disturbing you must never forget.
ANSWER TWO QUESTIONS:
1) Why were we never attacked on U.S. soil BEFORE BUSH?
2) Can a terrorist strike at us (I’m talking bus bomb, suicide bomber in mall, etc.) with relative ease?
I can understand the denial you’re all in.
Headshaker, we saw NUMEROUS attacks before 9/11. There have been numerous attacks SINCE 9/11.
It’s hard to fight 5000 miles away when there are 500K troops crawling up your butt 500 yards away. The attacks are still occurring.
For you to say otherwise shows either ignorance of recent history, or a willingness to distort facts for some other objective.
You are completely wrong on your suppositions.
Just for reference, do the following searches, just to get your started:
Somalia embassy
Khobar towers
Improvised explosive device
Taliban AND buddha statue
The word you need to check on dictionary.com is “perspective”
1) Shakey, do you think the parking garage of the World Trade Center just spontaneously combusted on February 26, 1993?
2) I don’t know. Part of me says yes — we’re an open society and someone could probably pull it off. Then again, al-Qaeda keeps swearing to bring the fight here, and they haven’t been able to since 9/11.
#50 - “If someone can give me a valid reason why we did not see multiple attacks BEFORE 9/11″
You’re kidding, right? Have you forgotten about the 1st WTC bombing, the USS Cole, the two embassies in Africa?
rj has it right: “You deny the obvious, and reject the truth.”
#54 Matt
Don’t forget the Hassidic Jew who was beset by a throng around that time as well, for being Jewish.
I’m guessing it wasn’t Jehovah’s witnesses who were the aggressors in that one.
(Apologies to the family of that victim for failing to remember the details.)
#54
1) You’re right; I meant a pattern though like in Israel. 2 attacks in the history of our country is not a pattern
2) It has nothing to do with “being able” to carry one out. Just use common friggin sense and forget the Bush-hater illogic.
Geez.
#52 headshaker
#1 See # 54
#2 Hell yeah OK City, Atlanta Olympics and these were supposedly our own guys! The terrorists are
committed to getting as many as they can.
Again, my point is ON U.S. SOIL.
Ya got no case.
Headshaker’s right. Bush should let them start killing us on US soil, like they’ve sworn to do, have done in the past, and are currently incapable of doing due to his actions to stop them.
We should let them killing thousands or tens of thousands before we do anything.
That’s what you’re advocating, right, HS?
#60
Wino, typical Conservative diversionary tactic which Big and sarge are great at. Put words in their mouths and get everyone to miss the original point.
I expected more from you, seriously.
#59 HS,
Ya got no case. Whether or not Bush is responsible/not responsible doesn’t matter. Terrorists exist, yes even in America. A few of them were busted recently in my hometown of Toledo, OH. Sorry they don’t fit your idea of what terrorists should do or be, but they are real.
Embassies are US soil shakey. So is a battleship. And it looks like the consensus is: you got no case!
This is such a ridiculous discussion I can’t believe we’re even having it. So I’ll just exit by saying that after 9/11 I thank God every night that GWB won (or as shakey would say, stole) the election in 2000 instead of Gorezilla and that he beat John “Why the long face” Skerry in 2004 because I’m certain there would have been more attacks had either election gone the other way.
Smackie, Beware the squirrels!
Y’all have a good afternoon!
Based on Shakey’s type of thinking, Pearl Harbor was an isolated event since there were no attacks by the Japs of any importance on American soil after 7Dec41. Wake, Philippines, Guam, etc. don’t count because they weren’t on American soil, just like two African embassies, Khobar Towers, and the USS Cole were not on American soil. And Matt must be right, the first WTC bombing must have been spontaneous combustion.
YWWPTYAL (™Hamous)
Well, headshaker, you are saying the reason we shouldn’t do anything is because we haven’t had such attacks. We’ve shown where you’re wrong on numerous points, yet you persist.
I have only drawn the logical conclusion from your words. If I am incorrect, then please point out the fallacy, and show where your meaning is otherwise… In other words, clarify which of my points (only one, in this case) is wrong, and what the fallacy is.
I think I’ve stated your case in terms too direct for your sensibilities, and that’s your objection.
From # 12: “to me, excuse me if we differ, United 93’s last moments were in the finest traditions and memories of this great nation made by ordinary people in an extraordinary moment who chose certain death rather than let some dangerous people kill others - I am not uncomfortable nor ashamed to see it - wish you were too”
You said this so well. This movie is a tribute to those who sacrificed thier lives on a day in history that we can not ever chance forgeting.
Yes, we need to remember muslims want us dead! period - no discusion, DEAD
Now: ALWAYS REMEMBER!
Painful to watch — probably, but should we not be reminded of what happened that day? I’m sorry, but the day that the major media outlets decided that the original footage was too disturbing to show was the day I resolved that we could never forget! I remember each and every detail of that day — and the days that followed. I listened to stories from friends in NY that no journalist ever heard. We all need to remember. Will I see the movie? I don’t know as yet because my memories still cause my eyes to fill with tears, but do I think it should be shown — you betcha!
Yes, we have people who are fighting to get into our country every day. We are the land of the free — home of the brave. But — we also have enemies. And war CAN and HAS taken place here at home.
Remember — Don’t ever forget!
Wait, Shakey, I don’t see what you’re getting at. The questions are kind of oblique. Are you saying that terrorism is overblown, it doesn’t exist, or what?
No one has provided a logical answer as to why we are not seeing (and never have seen) continual attacks on U.S. soil like Israel does.
Certainly, you can’t argue that we have adequate protection (borders, police, intelligence, etc.).
So why is it?
Okay folks, time to stop picking on (using logic and common sense) in your discussions with Shakey. We are all wrong and he’s the only one who is right.
YWWPTYAL (™Hamous)
#68 Matt
I’m just looking for a logical explanation, that’s all. Not “because of Bush’s leadership” crap.
#70 typical of you Big; when you can’t answer the question logically, you attack. But, unlike Wino, I don’t expect more from you.
#69 HS
You keep denying our points. We’re fighting them over there, rather than over here.
And if you think they wouldn’t or won’t strike here again if they could or can, you are too deep into Bush Derangement Syndrome for comfort.
Shakey, for goodness sakes, how many cells have been broken up by the FBI since 9/11? How many terrorist attacks have been thwarted (thanks much to the electronic eavesdropping which you so strenously object to). That kind of ostrich outlook will get us killed by the millions.
YWWPTYAL (™Hamous)
#73
Wino, and if you think they couldn’t strike here anytime they wanted to you’re living in the Brainwashed by Bush Club.
How you can even believe that they COULDN’T or CAN’T strike is beyond me. I’m not talking about a 9/11-type attack, I’m talking about an Israel-type attack.
Shakey, al-Qaeda (as opposed to Hezbollah, Hamas or other Palestinian terror groups) has repeatedly shown an interest in big, spectacular attacks. They want to terrorize the U.S. government by striking important symbols of U.S. political, diplomatic, economic and military power, here and abroad.
-USS Cole
-World Trade Center (twice!)
-Pentagon
-Embassies
Palestinian terror organizations, on the other hand, primarily strike at soft targets — people going about their daily business. They aim to terrorize the civil population by blowing up restaurants, buses, ambushing individual soldiers, etc.
HS, you keep implying that Afghanistan and Iraq have not prevented more attacks on US soil. I say that’s why we’re not seeing them (yet, probably).
It is from this I draw my conclusion that you think we shouldn’t be in Afghanistan or Iraq until we get attacked again. Since we’d be doing practically nothing to occupy them, they’d have time to plan something even more spectacular (look at bin Laden’s history for escalation), causing even more casualties… that would be thousands or tens of thousands, on our soil.
This is drawn from your comments. Where have I misrepresented you? I have not. I’ve just continued your train of thought.
You have done one thing, though. You’ve reminded me why 99% of the US population had exactly the same thought on 9/12: “Thank God Gore isn’t president.”
#74 Big - again, you miss the point, and again you misstate my position. I supported the eavesdropping under most circumstances.
Unreal.
#76 Matt - yeah, good answer. Not.
Headshaker
look, I’m not piling on but - can you pleeeease give us your logic and facts supporting that Bush has been totally ineefective, we were never attacked before, why you feel uncomfortable being reminded about flight 93, why all Republicans are evil but nothing about democrats etc
you make these very strong statements
back em up
no cussing
no hand puppets
79: ???
Shakey, you’re usually a lot better than this. What part of 76 do you disagree with?
Do you disagree that al-Qaeda prefers its attacks to be smaller in number but larger in impact? Or do you disagree that Palestinian terrorists prefer a larger number of continual attacks on more mundane targets?
I’m honestly not trying to play NIGYSOB. I really can’t see what you’re getting at.
#80
Eric, I NEVER said Bush has been totally ineffective. Certainly, there have been some good things done and we’ve probably delayed certain attacks. But again, if the terrorists really wanted to incite terror, they obviously could/can. It happens in Israel all the time, a much smaller country with much greater security than us. Do you not get this?
What I AM saying is that the terrorists don’t give a rat’s ass about Bush and his leadership. I don’t believe we haven’t been seen these types of terror attacks because of Bush’s leadership. That’s ludicrous, because they can accomplish this anytime they want to. I believe we haven’t been attacked like this because inciting terror is not their primary goal (by “their”, I mean the leadership of these radical idiots).
If it was, they’d be doing it more often, don’t you think, since it’s so damn easy.
#77 Wino - the conclusions you draw with respect to my points are erroneous.
I’ll make it simple: why have we not seen an attack on U.S. soil, any kind of attack, since 9/11? Because we’ve contained all the terrorists in Afghanistan and Iraq, is that your answer?
#69
Because your question is fundamentally flawed. Its like asking someone to draw a picture of the elephant that’s not standing next to me. Its glaringly obvious that its not there but you can’t draw a picture of it. And its been proven above that we pretty much had terrorist attacks on US soil continually during the Clinton years.
The terrorists saw how Bush would react when they tried it (think Joe Piscopo in Johnny Dangerously: “My grandmother tried a terrorist attack on me once……Once!”).
YWWPTYAL™
#84 Hammie
Nice try, but that answer is a miserable failure.
Shakey, if Mexico was Palestine, then we would be attacked a few times and then it would stop because we would build a wall. It’s not cheap to
terrorize the US. You have to get here first. Then
you have to acquire materials etc…
Your logic would have us not do anything until
we are attacked and one of your daughters were
killed.
Matt, did you ever hear of Al Qaeda before 9/11?
Shakey,its official. You have completely gone off your rocker. Laters.
YWWPTYAL™
Look mom, we’re all airplanes!
#86 Smackie
Did I say not do anything? You people amaze me how you make things up.
HS: I think that Matt is trying to point out the reason that we haven’t seen lots of terrorist attacks from Al-Qaeda is that they take a long time planning big specactular attacks, and don’t want to bother with blowing up buses, etc. We may well have thwarted a couple of attempts already on al-qaeda’s part. If the PLO or Hezbollah turns direct attention on the US mainland, we may well see more of the smaller attacks. In the meantime, I do believe that the other points of attacks on the WTC, the Cole, various embassies, etc. all count as “US soil”.
You obviously don’t agree that military actions in the middle east have had much impact on terror attacks on our soil. I disagree, in that we at least are occupying the “insurgents” who are likely diverted from other endeavours to discredit us in Iraq.
Mr Shaky,
#69;
The Israelis are attacked continually by Palestinians because they share borders and real estate.
You say “No one has provided a logical answer as to why we are not seeing (and never have seen) continual attacks on U.S. soil like Israel does”.
We are continually attacked by Latinos who share our borders and real estate.
Lets hope that these attacks can be stopped before they can escalate to suicide and car bombers.
Once again you fail to recognize the obvious and deny the truths.
rj
Hamous, liberalism is fundamentally flawed. That’s why it’s useless to try and debate them. No logic, no common sense. You can’t win a debate with a liberal when they are naked and refuse to admit it.
#90, Not to mention the fact that in order to plan such a big ticket operation, the leadership has to pop it’s head up out of whatever rathole they are hiding in and communicate with the rest of thier crew. Which gives us another opportunity to detect, intercept, decode, and target them. There is an old intel trick, if you cannot decipher your enemy’s communications, make them think you can and force them to change, that way, they have to spend time and energy reconstructing thier comms, AND you might get lucky in that they might inadvertently make it easier on you by choosing a less secure method of communication by accident. The reverse is also true, if you CAN read their mail, make sure you can make them think you can’t so that you ensure that all communication uses the compromised method.
#52
“1) Why were we never attacked on U.S. soil BEFORE BUSH?”
When was 911 planned? During Clinton.
#92
Not only that but if you try to tell them that their plan is not feasable, despite it’s good intentions, you are attacked and labled cruel, hateful, inconsiderate, evil, and a plethora of other lables. Then when you try to prove that they are wrong, the run around with their ears covered like a child saying “I’m not listening”
It is like trying to be reasonable with a 4yr old who is throwing a fit because you would not buy them a new toy…
#94 you are forgetting WTC in 1993 who’s watch was that under…
CLINTON
#90
Can you answer me as to why we haven’t seen those “smaller attacks”, ever?
Psycho GA Liberal Democrat Rep REPENTS…. NOT
http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/04/06/D8GQMPQ82.html
Look at how fast she has gone from yelling racism to begging for forgiveness…
Shakey you mean smaller attacks likethese
like these:
http://www.batreps.com/036t4.htm
As unhappy as we are with the GOP being spineless on many issues, remember this November, we almost had Al Gore for Pres. in 2001. Keep in mind what it will be like if the Dems take either the House or the Senate and are seated in January.
#101 Big
Then you should only be pissed at Bush and the Republicans for screwing things up so badly that we’re facing this situation, no?
#92 - Big, looking back in history there was a time when you could debate liberals. We had vastly different ideas on many issues but the security of our country was usually where everyone could agree, or at the very least, not obstruct. That era probably died with Humphrey.
#95 - bweldon - “It is like trying to be reasonable with a 4yr old who is throwing a fit because you would not buy them a new toy…”
Let’s put’em in time-out….about 50 years or so should do it.
#103 Hammie
Are you going to the Brew Ha Ha!™ this month?
#99
No…..Small attacks like these:
http://www.saturos.net/satyrgraphs/events/rockem/images/2005-09-17%200030.jpg
The only thing even remotely as scary as a clown….
An angry midget with a stapler!!
#103 Hamous,
I have found that time-out does not always work, sometimes you have to do more like take away their toys. Maybe we should just eliminate some of their welfare programs and make them earn them back.(never) happen.
#105/ #106 fast
And I thought I spent way too much time on the internet!
#103 Hamous, the difference is that back then they were Democrats and not liberals. They had the same core values. Conservatives have kept those core values. Liberals have thrown them out the window. Liberal values now are homosexual, envirowacko, socialistic, anti American, anti capitalism, pro terrorist, pro communist, pro drug use nonsense. That is why we used to be able to debate Democrats.
Now instead, we have to debate fools. What’s the old adage about never argue with a fool?…….
Shaker,
http://www.wral.com/news/7651436/detail.html
Does that qualify as a “smaller” attack? What about anthrax laced letters? Do those qualify? I think we have seen smaller attacks. As Hamous said, the premise of your question is faulty in the same way that “do you still beat your wife?” is.
#109 also back then the debate was how to solve the problem, not what the problem really is. Also today it is about feeling good about what you did not making the hard choices. As a public servant my self HOA and MUD board. I get more satisfaction from making a hard decision and doing the right thing vs feeling good about doing nothing.
#104 - Nah, can’t make this one. I’ll be in NW Missouri slaughtering helpless wild tom turkeys just out looking for some nookie. I can make really sexy turkey hen sounds.
#97 - IMO (for what it’s worth) - the separation between the US mainland and Al-Qaeda’s and other organizations base of operations may well keep them leaning toward larger ‘operations’. That may well be why there’s not so much worry about locking down the border. It may not be worth it to them to come over here with pipe bombs and small IED’s. They want the larger, more spectacular hits. Those take time, $$$, and are easier to intercept.
Now when a group of these guys manages to get a small nuclear device, all bets are off. All they gotta do then is get across the border and hit the refineries in Pasadena or something…
#112 Hamous, Kerry will testify against you:
had personally winged, cut off heads, used devices to mimic the sounds of meleagris gallopavo, blown up bodies, randomly shot at turkeys making only the distinction of bearded and not bearded, plucked feathers in a fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan……..
#97 (cont.) and what The Dude said…
Remember Hamous, if you shoot anybody by accident, they will accuse you of having consumed meleagris gallopavo.
#113 jimb
hit the refineries in Pasadena or something…
The smell would kill em before they could get the bomb to go off!
huh,huh, Hamous said “nookie”
#114 - LMAO! He would have really liked what happened a few years back. It was the last day I was able to hunt and I hadn’t bagged one yet. I finally called a big tom in so I blew his head off. Turned out his buddy that was traveling with him had been quiet. When he saw the tom flopping around on the ground he saw his chance to be the cock of the walk so to speak so he attacked the headless bird flopping around. So I blew his head of too. Regardless of what you hear, turkeys ain’t smart birds. They just have a powerful flight response…but not as powerful as the urge to kick your buddy when he’s down. Come to think of it that sounds a lot like…..
Okay, why have we not been attacked by the Cubans; or Red China or North Korea? Why hasn’t Japan attacked us again?
Why have no midgets ever been attacked on our soil since 9/11?
If the terrorists really, really want to kill us, why haven’t they attacked?
Open ended questions that no one can answer, but all can try to find out what you are infering? Then argue against the inferance. Simple.
The anthrax attacks were done by an American white male wacko scientist. The FBI knows who he is, but they never could prove it. He no longer works in that field.
I repeat my elephant analogy.
And aren’t all turkeys, indeed birds in general, homosexual or at least bisexual? After all a cloaca is a cloaca is a cloaca. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
Shakey knows why we haven’t been attacked anymore. We’re not smart enough to figure it out. And he’s going to keep the secret all to himself. He’s not even going to let DHS in on it. Okay, now we have have Dorothy pull the curtain back. Oh, is that you?
For liberals, life is like a box of cloaca. They always know what they’re going to get!
He’s probably an Illinois Nazi now. I hate Illinois Nazis.
Wasn’t there also a splodeydope on the University of Oklahoma campus? He got mad because they wouldn’t let him into the stadium, iirc.
Wino, they shut that up. His blew himself up prematurely on the bench across the street. Had Islamofascist literature all over his dorm room, and his Muslim buddies split the scene. They sure shut that up in a hurry!! I even remember is little bin Ladin goatee.
Of course in Kerry’s book, this would have need considered on the level of being a nuisance. Shakey, how many nuisance attacks does it take before we have to get serious? Is there an equation? X number of minor attacks plus X number of major attacks = one cause for action?
Dude:
#125
http://161.58.5.90/blues/illnazis.wav
ME TOO!
I think that if they attacked us now people like bobblehead will see the light and he and most Americans will be severly ticked off and get behind the war effort.
I went home to DC recently for Spring Break and went to the American History museum which is where the exhibit for a Memorial for 9/11 but on this visit it had been taken down. So, my answer is it has been too long, we need remember those souls who were lost forever. I was simply offended that that exhibit had been removed. So, I asked a curator who was there and they said that it had been removed, shock. Yes, too long. I think that we should start a writing campaign to the Smithsonian and DC newspapers, Washington Star and Washington Post, that expresses our displeasure. Thanks all.
#130 - Kraut, I don’t think so. It would be Bush’s fault we were attacked again because he hadn’t done enough or did too much and pissed them off and that’s why they attacked us. Liberals are a schizophrenic bunch. The only thing they’re consistent on is its always Bush’s fault.
#132 hamous
You are right, to the schizophrenics they are right and we are nuts.
Kevin, remember what the liberals tried to do with the Enola Gay exhibit…twist it like it was our fault. I even remember the guy that was in charge of that at the Smithsonian. He’s the same guy that made the mistake of refering to the Marine Corps War Memorial as a tacky piece of art (kitsch he called it). That was the end of him in charge of that exhibit. The Smithsonian ended up having the display as unoffensive to anybody….no mentions of the Bataan Death March, the live vivisection of Allied POWs by Japanese units, the murder of 300,000 civilians in Nanking in 1937. Heaven knows we don’t want to offend anybody.
Seems like HS went back to his website with his tail between his legs. Open ended questions = open ended answers. 20 to 1 is too much to bear!
#134, What is worse is that nobody talks about Japan’s Atomic Bomb program. What?? You didn’t know they had one? Yep, they did, two in fact! And there are some reports that they actually tested one two weeks before we dropped ours on Hiroshima on an Island off the coast of North Korea which is where one of the two teams went to to get away from the B-29’s. When the Soviets invaded they trucked all of that stuff back to Moscow. THAT was where Russia got the first A-bomb designs, not from the Rosenbergs. They planned on putting it on a Japanese U-boat and exploding the whole boat in San Francisco harbor. Every year when the aniversary of hiroshima rolls around they LOVE to try to make us feel guilty for bombing them, but what they don’t say is they were only a week or two away from doing the very same thing to us, we beat them by two weeks AT MOST. But of course they never mention that…
#135 neo
You’re right, you can be a real beotch. Typical woman, you always think you’re right and you’ve won the argument after your male counterpart decides to ignore you based upon the idiotic comments that emanate from your piehole which are a complete waste of his time.
No one answered the basic question, as I expected.
Enjoy the toad stew.
HS
Everyone answered the question with factual evidence that refuted your premise. But you continue to deny the obvious and reject the truth (thanks rj, good description). Oh, and #137 is a strange way of ignoring her.
#138 Hammie
LOL you crack me up. I love you man! See you soon.
I dunno, HS, I think I took a pretty good shot at your basic question in #113.
Not sure why the nastiness between you and Neocon, though. I was going to say that Neocon was off-base for assuming that you tucked tail and ran off, but you (unfortunately) took it to the next level there…
My uncle is tougher than yours?
America is dead!
Fighting over whos party is better?
We have truly let our country down while the politicians play the shell game!
You think they really care about you?
NOT!!
Jimb
140
Typical. When you can’t win an argument, you pick on the only girl posting and call her a bitch.
I reread my 137 and it does sound like a flame, so I am sorry for that. No need for HS to resort to calling me a bitch.
#142
neo, you said the other day you could be a real “bitch”. I’m just having some fun with you, that’s all.
Lighten up! You’re validating what I’ve been saying about you lately!
HS Nice try. Here’s the rest of your comment:
So I guess in your estimation, women should just shut up and remain silent while men weigh in on the weightier questons. That was very offensive. You are a mean-spirited little man.
#144
neo, I have 4 daughters, a lovely wife, and mostly female employees and friends who would beg to differ. Apparently you haven’t grasped my warped sense of humor yet.
Anyway, I sincerely apologize if you were offended by my rebuttal to your offensive post.
Neo/HS: Wow. Maybe time to go to your corners and cool off?
#146
jimb, I’m cool. I merely responded to an attack. It just happened to be neo this time, but it could have been anyone.
If you can’t do the time, don’t do the crime. If you can’t take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.
If you can’t handle the counterattack, don’t attack.
Man, I really wanted to reply to this yesterday but, couldn’t log on…Anyway - let me see, what was I going to say?
Oh yeah, What a stupid question(#52)!!! Are you dissapointed that the attacks have slowed down, not yet begun or can’t wait for them to start??
As I’ve said before, I know why your head shakes - because it ain’t screwed on right…
Of course the attacks COULD happen - thank God almighty they haven’t. Why even ask? What was the point?
HS, you are my favorite walking dichotomy.. Absolute nonsense mixed with logic…Hope to see you at the Cypress brew ha ha!
14 Rorshack,
I’ve been away from the machine for a few days.
Did the trailer make you so angry that you marched straight down to the local recruiting office and enlist?
Or, was it Juuuuust enough to make you post that picture again?
23 Kraut,
What a beautiful idea.
Utilize ones FREEDOM to make a CHOICE on whether or not to see it. Great idea.
Headshaker,
Sorry I wasn’t around to try to help you today.
It’s laughable how neocons always seem to forget taht 9/11 happened on George Bush’s watch, and continually blame it on Clinton.
And, I agree with your premise. Why hasn’t it happened again.
I can tell you all one thing I am hearing in my international travels in meetings with security experts (ex US, British Military types mostly).
That there are many cells in the states and UK now put there by Iran and Al Quaeda and that it is only a matter of time before another large scale attack is attempted.