When I saw the latest article on Elvira Arellano yesterday morning, the illegal alien that has refused to leave the U.S. and has been in a Chicago church’s protection for the past year, I had to set it aside because it didn’t look like I.C.E. was going to take advantage of the opportunity to arrest her.
The 32-year-old and her son took refuge last year. Arellano said she didn’t want to be separated from the boy, who was born in the United States.
She has since become a symbol of the struggles of illegal immigrant parents and a source of controversy, praised for her steadfastness and criticized as a scofflaw.
U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement officials declined to discuss their operations, but no uniformed agents appeared to be present at the church or rally.
Fortunately, I was wrong.
An illegal immigrant who stayed in a Chicago church for a year to avoid separation from her 8-year-old son, a U.S. citizen, was arrested Sunday and being processed for deportation.
Arellano was “being processed for removal to Mexico based upon a deportation order originally issued by a federal immigration judge in 1997,” U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement said in a news release.
She was first deported in 1997 but returned in 2000, just in time to have a son, Saul, who is an American citizen. She was arrested and convicted in 2002 for working under someone else’s social security number. In other words, she stole an innocent person’s identity. The legal process was slow and she wasn’t ordered to surrender until last year, which is when she decided to hide behind her American anchor.
Obviously, she thinks two things. One, that she is above the law and two, that the legal system is slow and will give her another 4 years. Wrong on both counts. She is not above the law. And today’s I.C.E. is far different from the system even last year. The Bush administration has gotten the message and is aggressively implementing current law.
“People will be sad about what happened to Elvira,” said Catherine Archibald, a member of the congregation and a friend of Elvira’s. “But I think it is very important now that we mobilize and push even harder.”
Ms. Archibald is correct, some people will be sad. The media will hype this story as an example of a family torn apart, maybe some enterprising reporter will find a way to get a Pulitzer. Her friends will be sad because they won’t have anything to talk about for a few weeks.
The rest of us will be relieved to know that our government is finally addressing this whole issue of illegal aliens. The rest of us will be happy to know that a person cannot steal the identity of another and get away with it because they are poor, illegal and are a single mom. Happy trails, Elvira.
UPDATED: This photo is making the rounds, trying to drum up sympathy for the son of Elvira, who doesn’t want his mother to leave him. As LST commenter I.P.A.Bill says, he’s moved several times during his lifetime and no one bothered to tell him that he could leave his kids behind.
The poster says “don’t let the migra take my mommy away”. Would not a better slogan for the young boy be “Mommy, why would you leave me behind?”
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Eyes that look like Mexico, lips like sherry wine
That girl can sure commit some crime
As I get a funny feelin up and down my spine
Cause the SS number she took used to be mine
So I’m screamin
Elvira, Elvira
Gonna throw you out Elvira
Tonight I’m gonna meet her at the jail house downtown
And as look at her ugly frown
I’m just gonna say Elvira dear
just get out of my darn town
Now I’m singin
Elvira, Elvira
Gonna throw you out Elvira
I am so pleased, ICE stepped up and upheld the law. With the nation watching, and every illegal, hopefully they will realize the laws will be enforced. Maybe a few of the illegals will start packing for home.
They should also grab Coleman and his wife.
Federal Immigration and Nationality Act
Section 8 USC 1324(a)(1)(A)(iv)(b)(iii)
“Any person who . . . encourages or induces an alien to . . . reside . . . knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that such . . . residence is . . . in violation of law, shall be punished as provided . . . for each alien in respect to whom such a violation occurs . . . fined under title 18 . . . imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.”
Section 274 felonies under the federal Immigration and Nationality Act, INA 274A(a)(1)(A):
A person (including a group of persons, business, organization, or local government) commits a federal felony when she or he:
* assists an alien s/he should reasonably know is illegally in the U.S. or who lacks employment authorization, by transporting, sheltering, or assisting him or her to obtain employment, or
* encourages that alien to remain in the U.S. by referring him or her to an employer or by acting as employer or agent for an employer in any way, or
* knowingly assists illegal aliens due to personal convictions.
It’s interesting the articles on this barely mention the fact she stole someone’s identity. One sentence……. arrested for a false social security number. It plays down the fact she was deported once, and came back pregnant to give birth. I hope she concentrates on cleaning up and making her own country a desireable place to live and work.
I moved from state to state several times over the years …. no one ever told me I was supose to leave the kids behind . Sure could have saved a lot of money !
#3 Carson
We have Casa Juan Diego in Houston that provides all that to thousands of illeglas every year while also enjoying a non-profit status.
You can google search and read all about it on their web site, they are very proud of their work.
So why doesn’t the Feds. shut them down, or at least strip them of their non-profit benefits?
#5 I’ve been wondering that too. Why would she have to be separated from her son? Answer - she won’t. Just hyperbole to tug on the heartstrings of the more sensitive. See the racist Republicans ripping little children from the arms of their mothers. To use a child in such a manner is disgusting. But what do you expect from someone that would steal another’s identity. I had a friend who’s identity was stolen. She was falsely arrested three times for another woman’s crimes. She never resolved all the problems until she got married and changed her name.
This is very encouraging news. It reminds me of something an old boss told me about sales. He likened it to pushing beans into a tube. You have to push a lot of beans at first just to fill the tube, but eventually they do start to fall out the other end.
I think justice is probably the same way. The wheels turn very slowly. We shouldn’t let that discourage us from doing the right thing though. When Americans get fed up enough we can get things done. We’re seeing it now.
Casa Juan Diego is run by Mark and Louise Zwick. They fancy themselves as continuing the tradition of Dorothy Day. They are some of the last vestiges of liberation theology, which is really just Marxist theology, in the Catholic Church.
# 7
Hamous
I also have a friend whose identity was stolen. She is a police officer and ended up with warrants out for her on bad check charges. They finally caught the guy that stole her purse, but still suffers from the repercussions by having to explain all the problems he caused.
The illegal alien and identity thief has a choice. She can take the child or abandon it. Her choice.
So the Feds. fine those who employ an illegal immigrant, even if they were fooled with false documents, while it supports Casa Juan Diego.
Why??
AZ, how is the federal government supporting Casa Juan Diego?
#11 Casa Juan Diego hides behind a Christian mantle of feed the poor, help the impoverished. The mayor is a democrat and can’t figure out what to do with these folks who come here hungery and broke…… I am guessing he figures the casa will stop a little of the crime ( while it commits it’s own) Build the fence, deport them, let them come in legally. How do we go about putting a flood light on Casa Juan Diego and getting it shut down? It won’t be a popular idea with those who run for office.
#13 I suspect all the half million dollar townhomes going up around Casa Juan Diego will put a flood light on the problem at least in that area. Liberals are very good at playing the NIMBY game.
If she would have come here on a green card and started the citizenship process, she would have been a US citzen by this time. Much easier to break the law, I guess..
Why would she even consider leaving her son behind?
She must be planning of painting the town red in Tijuana.
If Carson is correct in #3 they have been violating our laws foe years by giving illegal immigrants protection and shelter. I remember about 12 years ago Mark spoke at our church and stated people in Mexicoa, Central and South America know if they make it over the border they will receive protection and shelter at
Casa Juan Diego. So why does our government enforce the law?
Why does our government allow them to enjoy the benefits of a non-profit corporation?
We are being fed a bunch of b/s by our government, why aren’t they raiding construction sites and where new homes are being built? Who is paying who for protection?
Hamous
There is a difference between the story of your friends arrests and someone using another persons ss#
As I understand she didn’t steal an identity to commit fraud she used a fraudulent SS# to allow her to work she’s not being accused of using the number fraudulently (ie to steal, to bounce checks et al)
Your friends arrest 3 times is an astonishing one - worth a book - but was not from this person’s activities nor even attributable
And actually according to the BLS United States Citizens are the primary culprits of identity theft using others identities to steal not illegal immigrants
My how far we have come from the Elain Gonzales story
Wow!
Where?
Because they are focusing on the employers, where they should be. The only employers being “fooled” by fake documents are those that want to be.
BigJolly
Have you ever run a company? What expertise do you have in document forensics? Is it the responsibility of an employer to verify everything an employee presents?
I’m going to guess the answer to all theres questions is?
#17
That’s the silliest argument I’ve ever heard. By stealing someone’s identity she has already committed fraud. Illegal immigrants STEAL identities. If they commit crimes under those STOLEN identities the real person will suffer. My friend’s identity was STOLEN by an illegal immigrant.
Something else to consider, most of the time they aren’t stealing John Doe’s identity, they’re stealing Juan Venado’s. This crime hurts law abiding Americans of Hispanic descent disproportionately.
Hey I’ve had an epiphany. Let’s make the shameless hussy tell who knocked her up and then go after him for child support for the child she is leaving behind. No matter where he is.
“she’s not being accused of using the number fraudulently”
What does that mean? It’s ok, then?
Officer, I stole this car to get to work, not drive around committing burglaries.
#21 Hamous
Not only had she committed mail fraud as well. Using fraudulent documents to obtain anything of value is fraud.
You know Hamous if you weren’t so anti police labor protection you’d be all right.
“Theese questions is”
typing badly, bad typing
21
There is a BIG Difference between stealing an indentity and submitting a false SS#
Call the police and ask em
please
BJ, A perfect and true example that our gov. Is just playing a game. Do you recall a few months before Katrina the story in Houston was about a developer who was flying over his site near Pearland and the helicopter he was in was mistaken for an ICE unit and the workers fled the area?
For about three days they reported new homes under construction were not being worked on because of the rumors, even in northern Harris County, I remember an HISD official on tv begging for people to return their kids to school, and a spokesperson from ICE assuring people that no raids would occur. It was a panic, even Bill White was on tv telling people there was notrhing to fear. It was a great big kiss butt So if all these construction workers were legal why hid?
Why keep your kid home from school?
L2H
congratulate yourself that you just advocated sending a working woman who gave birth to an American Citizen back to a country without a place to stay, a job, money to live on, with just the clothes on her back
What a great day this is for America and might I add for this blog
Is it the responsibility of an employer to verify everything an employee presents?
Then why ask for documents at all if you aren’t going to verify them? If you ask for a Social Security card and they just give you a number. Refuse it. If they give you one Xeroxed on a piece of paper, refuse it. Accept a real one or send them down the road.
The Social Security Administration has an online verification here:
http://www.ssa.gov/employer/ssnv.htm
They also have an 800 number in case you don’t have a computer: 1-800-772-6270 And it’s instant!
If the document doesn’t look like the same one you have, decline it and ask for a real one or send them down the road. It ain’t rocket surgery!
Unless you really want illegals to take jobs away from citizens.
Wow, Banable Lecturer. Just wow.
I mean, what can I say to someone who dismisses a clear crime as stealing someone’s identity in such a casual manner. It’s akin to saying, “He only stole my car to buy groceries and go to work, there was no real crime done.”
If you cannot see that, I can only hope you are too lazy to vote.
Btw, does “BLS” stand for “Bannable Lecturer Statistics” or “Bull Liberal S%^&”?
On the Elian matter you brought up, Elain’s mother died getting him into this country where he became a political refugee by existing law. Elvira left her boy behind to score political points in support of commiting crime.
There’s no doubt in my mind which mother actually loved her son.
AZ, you’re kidding, right? You want our government to go running after every report of someone running from a helicopter? And, btw, how do you know that I.C.E. didn’t make a visit to the employer, where they should focus their efforts?
#24 I’m anti Labor, not just anti police labor. You make it sound like I have something against cops.
Adios Elvira. You broke our laws and spit in our faces. Take your son and go home.
# 28
Bannable Lecturer = G. W. Bush
;P
Almost everyone acknowledges most illegals work construction, have you ever read of a housing project in Houston being raided.
I believe it is because the big home builders shield themselves by using sub contractors who hire the illegals and therefore it is hard to charge and fine the big homebuilder with the deep pockets. The sub is a small operator who will disappear, no money to be made chasing him.
“sending a working woman who gave birth to an American Citizen back to a country without a place to stay, a job, money to live on, with just the clothes on her back”
Poor thing, did she come here with that kid in her belly wearing Versace maternity clothes? Now she’s being kicked out and they are taking everything from her.
She took a chance. She knew it was at least POSSILBE for this to happen. She commited two crimes (illegal entry and ss fraud) and was DEPORTED. She then snuck back in with a baby in her belly so she could take advantage of citizenship status of the baby. She’s a poster child for kicking them out! You’ll do anything to keep your lazy a$$ from having to mow the grass, eh?
Question: is Spanish a Core subject at Houston schools? My daughter goes to Catholic school and they announced at orientation that Spanish is now a Core subject, which means she has a midterm and Final and it counts towards whether you pass or fail 6th grade.
I’m not happy about it. I want her to learn Spanish, but I don’t want it to be mandatory.
What is the situation at public schools?
Thanks.
#28 Bannable
Lo siento mucho, que lastima!
Just like I send criminals to jail. You see she is going back to where she belongs.
Hamous
You have to admit your prefect storm story seems to fit your statements without any links.
Here’s a paper from the goverment why identity theft occurs - notice they didn’t touch on identity theftso they could work and pay taxes to a total stranger and into a system that they will never ever recieve benefits from
http://www.treas.gov/offices/domestic-finance/financial-institution/cip/pdf/many-faces-of-identity-theft.pdf
HS
spanish or a foriegn language has always been a core subject in many private schools in fact until a few years ago mowst schools in Europe had required all students to take English (except the UK)
#40 Cannibal Leper
I don’t care about Europe; plus learning English makes sense for Europeans and even Asians.
But forcing Spanish down our kids’ throats is not right.
If they believed it was an ICE unit and ran because they were afraid of a raid does that not indicate they might be illegal?
Do you not recall the story? It was on tv and in the papers for about three or four days?
And a ICE spokesperson was on tv and stated it was not an ICE unit and they were not verifying legal statuses at any construction sites.
Basara, Hamous
Using a false SS# to obtain benefits is fraud punishable by up to 30 years in prison
Using a false SS# to obtain work is a Felony punishable by up to 5 years in prison
Here’s a perfect case from Kansas
See guys heres another FACT and a LINK
http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/ks/press/July07/07_31a_2007.html
I’m outta here. Another thread hijacked by one not grounded in reality. And Headshaker, how come you’re not calling him on his crap? Huh? Huh? Huh? Just because he’s part of your “group” you give him a pass? DOTI! PODS! LSMFT! WWJD! Hypocrite!
Good riddance. Take your brat with you, Elvira.
39
Eric, you’re wrong. On page 4 of the link you provided it shows Resume Misuse and Impersonation as uses for the theft of identity.
Try reading the crap you link to. And… the treasury gets to keep the money left in the system, you really think they are going to toss out the BILLIONS of dollars there because of illegal aliens using a fraudulent SS number?
HS
then pull her out of Private School and go to another one, here in Doha they can either learn Arabic, Spanish or French - non of these I want either but thats the schools rules
When I went to college my college demanded that I also take a foriegn language, I substituted computer science at the time
Its not a new thing - in fact its going to become more of a required thing nationally.
#47 BL
It’s not practical to change her school. In the grand scheme of things the lesser of the evils is to just suck it up. Like I said, she needs to learn Spanish, I just want it to be her decision, not the school’s.
Faster
Keep your temper my point is that Hamous was asociating this womans crime of I-9 fraud with her friend getting arrested
Bit of a stretch, but as always it seems to always fit in an imperfect world these great stories of injustice that just happens to befall a dozen or so people that someone knows
#44 Hamous
I AM calling him on it. I think he’s off base here.
But I refuse to attack his character and moral conscience for expressing his opinion.
HS
As of last year at least, a foreign language was not mandatory to graduate from high school. In elementary school they learned a little, but it wasn’t considered a “core course”. If you take 2 years of foreign language (any - my kids took Latin) then you can go directly to a 4-year university because you have followed the “college path”. If you don’t take a foreign language you can still go to a 4-year university, but usually you have to do a couple of semesters at junior college first.
If I heard right (I was half asleep) she was on a tour and was scheduled to appear here in Houston. She is not only an illegal and a criminal she is trying to teach others why she should be granted amnesty.
She needs to be deported big time and her anchor baby can go with her. If she comes back again she needs to be put behind bars.
Adios mofo.
Its a start and since she is the face of illegal immigration that makes it a triumph by itself.
You can bet she wont take her son with her.
Hamous we are having a conversation
HS I hear this I was when Klein offered those ESL classes in all of the schools - english is to be the main language
If a school is offering a foreign language or demanding it in the name of pro illegal immigration or as a means to give it some third degree of legitimacy
THen you are correct to be suspicious and I will admit - the schools especially private ones can be really really pushy
But if its for the childs benefit then well, whats the harm
Personally, and I have posted it here time after time I am against any broadcasts in this country in a foreign language period that the official language is English and will be forever
So thats just me
I just think its sad that a working woman is separated from her son and sent away forever from him
And some people here are rejoicing?
America!
#43 BL
So you have acknowledged that she committed a felony. Why are we supposed to feel sorry for her. For one thing, she purposely got knocked up while not being married, then waited until practically the due date to sneak BACK into the US after being deported previously. She deserves no compassion - the person whose SS she stoles deserves it. And if she cares so much about her kid she would not leave him behind. If her country is so horrible, then why doesn’t she (and all the other 20 million illegals) work to make it better instead of scamming the Americans who have worked hard to make OUR country a great place. Anyone who defends this criminal behavior is either too lazy to do manual labor themselves or too cheap to pay Americans to do what the illegals are doing.
54
Yep thats right her only crime was to come here and work
Hell we should strip her from her earthly belongings, strip away her children and force her to live in impoverished exile..
No wait we just did that….
#51 dcgirl
Thanks. Now it goes up me even more.
But I know what’s happening. The Catholic Church sees revitalization and big dollars in Illegal Immigration. That’s why they support it and Elvira.
She’s not racist, but she’s aware of the problems illegals bring even at 11 years old. She came home from her first day and said most of the new students this year are Hispanic.
And I quote: “I’m glad I got those shots at the doctor the other day.”
That should go up the rear end of every American a million miles. Our kids shouldn’t have to worry that their fellow students are bringing diseases from their home countries. Are they even requiring illegals to be vaccinated in school? And how are they paying tuition?
Hamous, what’s your take on all this from a Catholic perspective?
Oops, re my #56, change “She’s” to “My daughter’s”
I am no PHD in math but how can an eight year old son be born in 2000 ? perhaps his docs are fake as well.
or he was born in Mexico and they are claiming he was born here for sympathy.
HS
English shall be the only language broadcast, printed and spoken by the government except in law enforcement situations
I have always believed in it
you are right to be suspicious if your school is making a statement by only offering spanish
My oldest is taking Arabic and the guy keeps trying to convert the children to Islam
Oh happy days……
Eric, since the time you tried to pass yourself off as being at Centom and in the military (you never really said, but implied many many times your ‘associations’ there) I have never had any respect for, or believed anything you have said. You are willing to overlook the crimes this woman has committed and overlook the crimes commited by millions and millions coming to this country. If they were fleeing a murderous regime that slaughtered its citizens that would be different. But, no, they come here looking for something better than what they have at home. They have a home. It is their home. They come here, tou our home, and under price their labor and make the citizens here have to compete at a lower cost for a wage that will not sustain an American citizen. You are willing to screw the poorest and least skilled Americans in favor of cheap laborers from a foreign land that break our laws. I question your sanity, your character, and your patriotism!
Faster - Well said!
NIGYSOB?
http://www.brandens.net/
link not working… crap!
55 - she made the choice to commit a felony. She should lose everything that she had! She needs to make restitution to the person whose identity she stole and to the taxpayers whose money she took grabbing all the free goodies (including as I hear, ritalin for the kid). I don’t feel one bit sorry for people that come here just to make money and send it home. They are taking from our citizens to give to their home countries where they still pledge their allegiance. They are nothing but leaches here to take whatever we are stupid enough to let them steal. Maybe if your identity was stolen and you had to deal with the problems, or if you were hit by an uninsured illegal, or if you had another crime committed against you by an illegal you would think differently.
She knowingly broke the law. She used the church like a useful idiot. She used a false SS#. So why is anyone sad that she is gone? Just 19,999,999 more to go…one at a time. As long as it takes.
I’m calling ICE about Casas Helena…..Realistically I expect no postitive results but at least I will try. This young boys mom, left him with a stranger….. an activist attorney……. Guess she plans on returnging very quickly. She committed crimes here, why was she just deported and not arrested and put in jail? Why didn’t we arrest her for adentity theft, and the crimes listed above?
#56 shaker
As not only a Catholic but a member of a family that gave many gifts to the church in Jersey including building a retirement home for priests, and who’s father was a grand knight I say do not donate to the church. Dry up their funding and you will make them change their direction on this.
But also watch who your donation to United Way goes to.
Since Casa Juan Diego is a non-profit is there anyway we could find out who donates to them?
This picture of a law breaker needs one of my “Top Ten” list of captions. So here goes:
1) Mommy, why does President Bush hate us so much?
2) Mommy, thanks for sneaking into this country so I could become a US citizen.
3) Mommy, why can’t you just break the law, again?
4) Mommy, let’s call HELLary and give her a good photo op.
5) Mommy, can’t you just steal another identity?
6) Mommy, let’s just go back to Mexico. Everything is so great there.
7) Mommy, don’t the Dimwits need you as a registered voter?
9) Mommy, I’ll just wait until you sneak back into this country.
10) Mommy, why don’t you just call LULAC?
I hope everyone likes these.
By coming here illegally (and using the false SS info), then having a child, she knowingly placed that child in jeopardy of being separated from her at some point. This is tragic for the boy; he didn’t ask to be placed in this situation, but it’s on her.
#67 AZ
Good in theory, but it won’t happen.
People, things are too far gone. Go anywhere in Houston and you are the minority. Go to any mall or store, and you hear Spanish more than English.
The few who are fighting are losing and will lose in the end. Why? Money as usual. Businesses are catering to illegals. Government is catering to illegals. Schools are catering to illegals.
DJ was right.
Now, if you can’t beat them, join them. That is what the mentality is changing to, you see and hear it everywhere.
Faster
You can attack me personally all you want
Yes I confess I said I was the commanding general, the head of the CIA station here, personal friend of James Bond, and the Govenor, Dans Brother, Edds cousin and I it was I who invented the internet
Now that we have all that out of the way
Do(did) you have a point sir? we were having a discussion about a variety of topics one being I think the situation is sad you can disagree and you can be as ugly as you want to be about it if you wish
BTW you were inaccurate in your descriptions of my posts - let me add again
When you cool down and quite calling me all those christian consevative names
come back we can discuss - do you agree she is being punsihed? Or for you its not enough
Yep thats right her only crime was to come here and work
Hell we should strip her from her earthly belongings, strip away her children and force her to live in impoverished exile..
No wait we just did that….
71
You’re kidding right? Her crimes were illegal entry into our country, after already being deported once for this same crime. She stole identity. Those are 2 crimes right there. Maybe there are more that we haven’t heard about. What about child abandonment?
70 Shakey - I get ticked when I go to the grocery store and see items that I used to be able to buy no longer on the shelf because that same shelf space is being used by items with the total label in Spanish. I don’t want Fabuloso detergent or spanish labeled Campbell’s soups, etc. Keep that junk at Fiesta. At least their name indicates what will be available.
dcgirl
And she’s being punished no?? Being seperated from her children, being sent into an impoverished exile is a cake walk?
Wow!
I made my call to ICE houston, the lady laughed and said she didn’t know anything about Casa Juan Diego, and put me through to an agent…… only it was a voice mail. I left my message I’ll call every day
Eric you cannot exile a person to their own country, it’s called returning home….. DC girl we need to avoid feeding the troll…….. although I just did….. it’s hard to not!!
Bites tongue and smacks fingers not to reply…….
Eric, I think you come down on the side against that which the commenters here take just to get attention for yourself. If your position is “she just wanted to work, cut her a break for the multiple laws she broke and the multiple times she gave America the finger” you are worse than I thought. Headshaker won’t question your character, but I will.
Understand this: NOBODY STRIPPED THIS WOMAN FROM HER CHILDREN.
I stopped donating to the United Way a long time ago, back when I realized they financed, among other things, abortion clinics…
Jimb
Thanks for questioning my character hey and even someone who disagreed with me as well but just wouldn’t call names for having an opinion that I think she’s being punished
Yes you are correct this is a day that justice has made we have stripped forced a woman to decide for a better life for her child, she is stripped of her worldly possessions, her clothes, her family heirlooms and she is being sent back to her “Home” country ironically most of us came from our home countries cause they were such great places to live in freedom now weren’t they?
“Being seperated from her children”
Poor thing… a trail of alligator tears? She is being sent to her OWN home. And no one says she can’t taker her kid that was created in Mexico and squeezed out here with her. She was deported and returned, defying the laws of this country twice, and a court. You pretend to be so enamoured with the rule of law, but cannot stomach enforcing it against an illegal alien. Why? You distort the truth, misrepresent what others say and have the gall to pretend to be offended.
“When you cool down and quite calling me all those christian consevative names”
Last night you were pretending jimb made a death threat against you. Eric, you are a hollow little man and if using your own rhetoric and words against you is calling you names, so be it. I just called you a hollow little man, the FIRST time I called you a name, BTW. I’m not mad, I’m laughing at you. You are not nearly as significant as you give yourself credit for. What’s the beef against Christians, anyway? You like to call others a hypocrite a lot, but are above reproach yourself. Eric, the CENCOM warrior…. I am not perfect, my relationship with God is between He and I. Yours is not is between you and God. I never questoined your faith, but your loyalties to this country. I still do and the noise coming from you doesn’t dissuade any of my beliefs.
Here’s your post from last night:
#401 Bannable Lecturer Says:
August 19th, 2007 at 3:25 pm
Jimb
I was refering to something Marc said to HS ans Smacktle
I suggest that you are just ignorant. You think I am EVIL??? look at yourself first. I pity you. Look over todays Shakey statements. They speak for themselves, Yours also. Get a life. See you tomorrow, God willing.
Just another christian doing the work of the Lord hoping someone isnt dead again
Geez louise
I’m done with you.
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OKAY GUYS, TIME TO TONE IT DOWN. LST MODERATOR
Are you kidding?
Go to the social services office of any parish in town, and ask about the net cash flow from illegal aliens.
That is:
Illegal aliens’ contributions, less the value of services provided to them.
If you can find any parish where that number is greater than zero, I’ll eat my hat.
Hopefully the tax status of this “church” is also under review. It’s time to clean out the entire underground railroad, not just a few high profile criminals if they are serious - which of course we know they are not.
Actually, she got off easy. As BL points out (#43), she committed a felony by using a false SS number. She could have been tossed in prison for years. Instead, we just deported here, so she will be back any time. /whoosh. There she is now.
Unfortunately, BL makes flat out false statements in #55 when BL says her only crime was to come here and work! Just 12 posts after BL said she had committed a felony!
BL is logic-challenged and not credible. Why do you people take the bait from a goofy provocateur?
#81 Matt
It’s not about present dollars, it’s about future dollars.
Look at the big picture my son.
How have generations of Mexicans been born with no desire to improve their homeland? Did they remove the ” make my country better ” gene? I’m curious why, after sneaking into the USA, and seeing how this life is, they wouldn’t want to duplicate it there.
EPJ is singlehandedly converting the entire LST community to magnum Headshaking status with this thread.
#31 BigJolly
We do not have to track down every report of someone running from a job site when a helicopter flies over. We also do not need to go on television and beg people to return to work and school and promise them that that ICE will not deport them if they do.
Personally I think we should paint ICE in really large letters on several Helicoters and fly them over job sites on a regular basis. When they get used to the flights then real agents need to show up and deport all of the ILLEGAL workers.
81
They go well with a nice bbq sause
Matt, would you also think that anyone seeking parish services probably receives more in services than in contributions?
Also, Medicare, Social Security, welfare could this probably also be the case that the moneys are collected from the top 10% of taxpayers and distributed to the lower 50%
I was curious
56.
The Church is getting rich off illegals? How? That’s comic relief, right?
88. You are just plain wrong. Many, many, many people donate far more to the church than the cost of any services they use.
Where do you get your information?
84.
Future dollars? What, do you have some insight that the wages for dishwashers and grass cutters are due to skyrocket?
Lawrence
I just though the woman was being punished enough, the though of enjoying seeing a give me your tired your poor being sent home without her child was nothing to be doing victory laps about
that was it
#92 Rick
So you’re saying that the Catholic Church is not actively courting the Hispanic community and has no interest in increasing its membership with Hispanics?
#85. They must have Duplication Dyslexia - the need to move to a another country and recreate/convert it to the country they came from. It won’t be long and the APA, AMA, etc. will establish this syndrome as compensable disability.
“being sent home without her child”
She’s leaving the kid here, she CAN take him with her.
Another distortion.
96
Would you leave a child here with relatives so the kid could grow up in America, safer, better educated, have the dream she had or would you want an American citizen to go into certain poverty and exploitation?
Thats the decision she had to make
My question is why do we allow this to happen, hasent she proven like Abraham that she’s willing to give up her child?
My gosh what have we come too?
Is there no pound of flesh that will solve this for some people - think man think - isn’t she being punished enough - isn’t this sad enough for you?
The richest man in the world is in Mexico.
Seems like there’s opportunity down there.
I was recently in Mexico City; it was bustling. They have a strip of road that rivals Rodeo Drive.
So, why are they all coming here?
#79
I was born here and so were my relatives for the last 350 years. However, the ones that did come (legally I might add) here from other countries were interested, yes in bettering themselves, but they also pledged allegiance to their new land, worked hard with no handouts, fought and died for this country, and did not commit crimes. Little bit of difference there, no?
As I understand it she left her son with a lawyer, stranger who is part of the ” make the USA, mexico” crowd. She didn’t leave him with Aunti Lucia.
Sometimes it’s just hell to deal with the consequences of our own actions. Some might call that personal responsibility, but I don’t think that is PC anymore.
If Mexico (and other countries the illegals come from) are so horrible, why do they continue to try to make America into it? Wouldn’t they want to dissolve their allegiance to those horrible countries? Wouldn’t they want to embrace all that is American? No. They are here for the buck to send home and to exploit their children. She didn’t bring him here for a better life. She squeezed him out here at the last minute in order to make her own better. She is using her child. She doesn’t care about him other than what his “anchor baby” status can get her. She left him here in order to further her cause that she be allowed to stay illegally. And Mexico has plenty of money. If the people would stay there and demand the corruption to end, maybe then they wouldn’t be in such a hurry to come here. But, then again, they enjoy stealing from us and laughing at us while giving us the finger. If they want to come here to better themselves, they need to do it LEGALLY!
101
Rastus
I agree with you 100%
But I think the situation is sad and this person is famous this is going on countless times right now families seperating for the American dream
I just can’t rejoice in the “justice” of it
#97
She was sent home once after being caught breaking the LAWS of the U.S. She returned ILLEGALLY, 8+ months Pregnant, so sge could have a kid in the U.S. in order to have shallow thinkers gush over her and tell everyone how insensitive we are when we send a felon back to her own home country.
She was not stripped of her son, she left him behind. She has been flaunting the laws of the U.S. for years for her own personal gain. We should have sent her to prison before sending her home. If she ever shows up here again I hope we do.
Eric - trl3 has a point. She could have been sent to prison (and should have and then deported when she got out). How many women have committed crimes that could be said that was to further their economic outlook and were sent to prison, separating them from their children? Do we excuse all crimes if the felon says it was “for the children”?
#103
What part ILLEGAL do you not understand?
She came here pregnant as part of a plan to try to force the U.S. to accept her. She left without the Kid in order to gain sympathy from people like you. If there were Justice we would not allow people like her to flaunt the laws of this country.
I think this troll will get pudgy if we keep feeding him…… and trolls don’t take kindly to facts.
dcGirl
Spend tax dollars on sending someone to prison for WORKING?
So sign you up for how many pounds?
What is so hard to understand about this issue,\
1) someone came into this country ILLEGALLY and was caught convicted and sent home.
2) she comes back later again ILLEGALLY and this time pregnant and has a kid here.
3) she is caught and convicted of identity theft and illegal entry again… ( seems like 3 strikes to me)
and now she is hiding behind sanctuary. If she had been a citizen in California, ( a liberal state) she would have had her kid taken away from her. she would be in prison for life… At least she had the opportunity to take her child home, but she and the other “enlightend” feel good people decide that since the kid is a “citizen” he should stay here and be separated from his family. All this is doing is giving her more incentive to try to come back again illegally.
One thing that would have made this issue really easy to fix is the elimination of the anchor baby provision we have in our citizenship laws. I believe we are the only country that allows non-citizens to have children here and bestow upon them citizenship.
trl3
The poor who try to work hard and raise a family will always have my sympathy
condemn me as you will
Bweldon
One thing that would have made this issue really easy to fix is the elimination of the anchor baby provision we have in our citizenship laws. I believe we are the only country that allows non-citizens to have children here and bestow upon them citizenship.
How many died for the 14th amendment?
So do we repeal it for just the browns? What about the non-browns?
#110 BL
No one is arguing that we shouldn’t have sympathy for hard-working people.
But you can’t have sympathy for someone who works hard and knowingly breaks the law for their own benefit.
If that were the case, then a lot of people in prison wouldn’t be there right now, and breaking the law for “good reasons” would create chaos. It makes no sense.
#111, there is a big difference between someone who is a legal immigrant here having a child and some one who is illegal.
Right now we give anyone who is born on our soil citizenship, regardless of their parents status. That is wrong. If someone enters the country in the proper manner, I have no problem with their children being citizens, because the majority of those people will either work toward citizenship themselves, or will maintain proper LEGAL immigration status.
Bannable:
So you support letting every felon in prison out as long as he said he committed his/her crime for his children.
Or just how much crime are you willing to accept from any one person, for the children of course?
Why are we even arguing about this?
She knowingly broke the law, more than once. She was punished, rightfully so. She probably got off easy.
Personally, I think she became a pawn for several special interests groups, including the Catholic Church. Someone gave her bad advice for their own self-serving interests.
Everyone knows who bannable is and how he acts, However if we state it plain language we end up with a “DELETED”.
Elvira has no objection to the country whose laws made her son a legal citizen.
She has no qualms with leaving him in that country, away from her, his mother.
Yet she finds fault with laws pertaining to identity theft and deportation.
So what are you really saying, Elvira?
Everyone with functioning gray matter should know why the prevision making anyone born here a citizen. They should also know the provision was never intended in allow the “anchor babies” of ILLEGALs to become citizens. This is an error we should correct. SOON.
#118 Well said!
Eric - she wasn’t punished for wanting to work. She was punished for breaking the law (let’s see- illegal entry and identify theft and falsifying federal documents). I think she should also be punished for taking a job away from an American and stealing taxpayers money.
Bannable #110
“The poor who try to work hard and raise a family will always have my sympathy”
Mine too, right up until the time they break our laws to do it.
Would you allow me to break into your home and steal your stuff if I am only working hard to raise my family?
For the record, it wasn’t the Catholic Church that gave this woman sanctuary, it was Adalberto United Methodist Church.
Tomorrow boosh will be in Motebello, Canada to give more of the US to illegals. The SPP is where boosh can make his quiet secretive deals to allow more illegals in for more free programs. The illegals don’t pay SS taxes they are independent contractors and not employees - as such they pay neither SS or Income Taxs and the contracting companies don’t collect or pay taxes for them. As an independent contractor you pay your taxes quarterly and not monthly. The false SSN the illegal provides has no taxes paid to it. The contracting company is not liable for the false number and even if the number is traced and found to be false the contractor can take a new name and another false SSN to continue the cherade. boosh has already made it so the illeglas here can qualify for SS and Medicare after 10 quarters where American citizens need 40 Quarters. In a recent Medicare Bill passed by congress money was shifted from the elderly Medicare receipient to the illegals for Medicaid. All this is being done with the blessing of the boosh administration and congress. boosh, goodhair, gutless hutch and cronyn are all A** deep in this lying to the taxpayers and voters. If you get the chance to listen to KLBJ 590 out of Austin they have several good talk shows which are very informative about all the SPP, boosh, goodhair and congress working together towards the NEW WORLD ORDER.
#118
Some European countries and the UK have already correct this mistake.
Good riddance to bad rubbish.
Fine. Take the present value of the expected revenue stream from illegal immigrants and compare it to the present value of services provided to them. Use whatever discount rate and revenue growth rate you’d like.
Again, the number will be negative.
Shakey, I have no idea why you’re so interested in slamming your own Church, but the slams are misplaced.
The woman was not living in a Catholic church.
#127 It’s that bizarre tangent thing again. Doesn’t matter what the contributor was trying to convey. It’s what HE wants to talk about.
#127 Matt
Is the Catholic Church courting Hispanics or not? Let’s try to keep it simple.
Hamous, why don’t you STFU for now? Practice what you preach.
Shakey, knock it off.
Yes, the Catholic Church is interested in maintaining membership among a traditionally Catholic demographic. To suggest it’s for money is tacky and financially illiterate.
You might as well claim Mother Teresa was making a killing off those Calcutta lepers.
#131 Matt
It’s not just for money. It’s for the revitalization and growth of the church.
I never said I had a problem with it, but let’s call it like it is.
Do you have other reasons also that would make sense?
We’re just having a legitimate discussion, don’t let emotions get the best of you.
#26 - Last I lQQked they send us to the same jail no matter if we stole from a local 7-11 or a bank (unless you consider a federal prison a measurable difference)
#132 He just gave you one.
But that doesn’t fit your agenda so you ignore it.
#130 Oooh, a bit touchy aren’t we? And exactly where have I been preaching?
Shakey, you’re accusing me of being emotional? Wow.
The notion that the Church wants illegal immigrants so that it can get more Catholics doesn’t make much sense.
Look at it this way: what would happen if we ended illegal immigration? You’d have a whole lot of people staying in Mexico and staying Catholic.
Where do you think Carl Marx got his manifesto “The End Justifies The Means” from the Protestants?
#137 - Let me guess. From the Catholics?
Except that was Machiavelli, not Karl Marx.
Matt
Let not cast emotional stones i just noticed this little emotional post can you identify the author?
[snip]
In fact, I’m not necessarily talking about Hispanics at all. I also don’t want Anglos, blacks or anyone else to illegally immigrate and bring their crime-sodden customs along.
I’m talking about first-generation illegal immigrants from Latin American countries where law and order are weak, and where corruption thrives.[snip]
I wonder who wrote such an emotional snap at 150 million poor people casting them all as “crime sodden customs”
Hmmmmmm
Machiavelli said that?
I guess that in Eric’s world the end (getting money from the US) justifies the means (illegal entry). So Eric, does that mean if I look poor and pitiful enough I can break into your home and take things of value from you?
And now I’m fixing stats? well I’m glad you acknowledge that the statistics in no way back up your generalizations
Here’s another one
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri_percap-crime-total-crimes-per-capita
US 8th most crimes per capita
Mexico 57th
The US according to the these people, who use only official statistics from official sources (ie NOT World Net Daily), so the US has a 5 times greater crime rate than Mexico.
So were you refering to the Americans coming to Mexico bring their crime sodden ways or vice versa?
dcgirl
most people don’t break into my house ansd clean it or landscape the lawn for 1/2 the pay
#141 - The concept (not the exact phrase) comes from Machiavelli’s “The Prince”. Coincidentally, that was one of the books that was banned by The Church so I find it surprising that that philosophy would have been usurped from Catholics.
Matt,
From the Board of Directors of the KofC:
immigrants should be “provided an avenue by which they can emerge from the shadows of society and seek legal residency and citizenship in the United States?”
Bannable:
So you are saying that it is okay for Criminals to break in to your house and take whatever as long as they clean up and mow the grass and only charge you half as much.
How about if they just work hard at my house for 1/2 as much and break into yours to make up the difference. Afterall you can aford it.
I don’t know where half the pay comes from, but the lawnworkers who are hispanic, mow lawns in my neighborhood for the same price as the others. The helpers who don’t install the floors but do the manual work, earn $10.00 an hour to start and work up from there. I do think the illegals are more willing to pick crops……. but also believe we can modernize the way things are done, to illiminate that problem I believe they have already done that with tomatoes. My lawn mower is a white high school kid who charges a little less and does a beautiful job. My point is, I am not sure the wages are all that abismal for illegals willing to work. Maybe if they stand on a corner and are picked up for odd jobs, they are taken advantage of.
Our system is overloaded with social program pay outs to these illegals families. It’s not so much that the illegal comes here for work, it’s the added bonus windfall he gets from our government. Matt is right, when you factor in all social program aid….. the benefit of the illegal is small compared to his cost. The company who hires him, doesn’t bear the burden, each tax payer does. That means everyone from taxable age to the time of death.
They already are…
AW
Thats why I consult to move factories overseas, people here in the US by and large are to large to do physical work and want vacation, sick days, health care, I just want them to work and work well, if they want that stuff then they can go out and buy it
As far as sick days every company I go into I run a neat little program that calculates sick day fraud
One company guy is still laughing at how his staff almost has perfect attendence since he banned sick leave
(BTW he does send people home sick or makes sure they don’t drive in when gravely ill and he pays it - but its a decision he makes)
#143 You might want to check that again, Mexico is 39th. However if you look at a breakdown
http://www.nationmaster.com/country/mx-mexico/cri-crime
you will see Mexico ain’t a very nice place to live. Since the site does not let you view national stats from the US, it is hard to make a side by side comparison on types of crime. I’m betting we have more people convicted of IRS fraud than Mexico.
Job Description No. 1459 - Factory Relocation Consultant
Matt,
Why does the church support illegal immigration then?
Step away from your faith for a minute and look at it from a business perspective. It makes a lot of sense, since many of the illegals coming across are Catholic.
Are you also saying that illegals aren’t contributing to the economy? If that were the case, then why are businesses catering to them?
They indeed have money to spend.
FaRCe
Pope John Paul II is dead.
Explain Cardinal Mahoney’s position.
And for the record, I have no problem with the Church courting illegals. If we’re going to allow them in, let them be Catholics.
Mexico’s second in number, gross national product is money from the USA. First is oil. I can’t find the link
Bannable
I have to wonder if you get vacation, sick days, and health care. I doubt your job requires any Physical labor. You sir are a hypocrite, but then everyone here knows that.
Yes, we understand you want workers that will work hard for 1/2 pay, no benifits, and you do not care who else is harmed or has to pick up the tab for everything you will not provide.
Yes, we understand that you are PRO ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION and ANTI BORDER ENFORCEMENT because apparently it is personally profitable for you.
You know, lawyers make a lot more money that I. I could provide for my family a lot better of I printed up a fake law degree and started ‘practicing’ law. You don’t think I would be prosecuted for trying to improve my economic status?
154 Duh Moose
Yep you’re right Mexico is 39th in total crimes vs the United States 8th place ranking but the difference of 80 per thousand to 13 per thousand it a big gap….
Sooo it still doesn’t add up Matts comment about Crime sodden customs - unless of course he was referring to us Americans
161 Trl3
If I keep advising steel mills to open or even to stay in Mexico, where is that causing illegal immigration if those jobs say… are still in Mexico?
You lost me with your logic
And I’m for the fence, just not a shoot to kill rule for BP agents who go overboard
Enough of the gratuitous use of the bold tag - MODERATOR
Any Church or Non Profit organization that actively participates in ILLEGAL activity should have their non-profits status revoked and those involved in the ILLEGAL activity should be prosecuted.
Any business or individual that knowingly employees ILLEGALs to work should be fined.
Government should ban ILLEGALS from receiving any government assistance.
AW
They also produce alot of steel coiled steel that is used in steel buildings the huge mills in Monterey produce much of the United States consumption of that niche product
Bannable
Show me one a single instance where my self anyone on this board has ever advocated or supported a shoot to kill rule for anyone involved in border protection.
#161 - Amen. It is people with the thought process like his that has forced women to work instead of being able to stay home to care for their children. The cost of living has skyrocketed over the last few decades, people can’t afford to pay their property taxes that are seized to pay for illegals’ and others that cannot take care of themselves. Companies are paying the men less than what they would have made comparatively when my dad was in the workforce. If the corporations would pay fair wages and illegals weren’t undercutting American’s wage requirements then maybe there wouldn’t be so many on welfare or using the emergency room for health care. It is a ripple effect. Pay Americans a fair wage, give good working conditions, and reasonable benefits and you will get hard workers who give you their loyalty. But most workers know now that if the employers can get someone for a little less, they will be out the door. And if the company can send the work overseas so that they can employ slave labor and get shoddy products (can you say Chinese) they will do it. Eric - you should be ashamed of yourself. Why don’t you come back to the US and put up with the garbage that the rest of us do everyday from the illegals instead of shafting your fellow citizens every chance you get. BTW - do you work for 1/2 pay, no vacation, go in sick, and have no benefits or is it just the poor that you are able to exploit with that?
I’m not Catholic, so I can’t say anything with any real knowledge, but I believe it is everything to do with Liberation Theology. The Social Justice crowd is leeching into churches, all of them. Some of the Protestant flavors of Christianity are embracing this garbage too. They hide their “theology” behind the superior moral stance of justice for the downtrodden. When it’s actually closet communism hiding behind the cross. Eric’s arguments echo theirs (but I have no idea where Eric is coming from other than to start an argument).
“There can be no doubt where authoritative Catholic teaching has stood on this question. [on socialism and communism] Pope Leo XIII (1878-1903), in the first year of his papacy, devoted an encyclical against socialism which cited his predecessors. These had in turn built their position upon earlier Scholastics who stood in a line of orthodox theologians dating back to the Church Fathers, in a anti-socialist tradition that extends from the earliest centuries to the current day.
snip…
A soft version of liberation theology also thrives among the Religious Left in the U.S. Whether it is raiding corporate boardrooms to protest outsourcing, blanketing churches with Green political propaganda, agitating for higher welfare budgets or arguing against tax cuts, the underlying ideological assumptions are clear enough. The Religious Left starts with the assumption that there are certain conflicts in life that are intractable: the rich vs. the poor, prosperity vs. the environment, tax cuts vs. charity, and localism vs. globalism. This is a soft version of the original liberationist idea, sold in the name of “social justice,” “business ethics,” “social responsibility,” and many other catchphrase”
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/guides/Z-Catholics%20for%20Marx.htm
To me, these guys do not represent the Catholic Church any more than the Baptist Church that “hates fags” represents Baptists. This criminal was hiding in a Methodist church. Liberation theology is to blame not the doctrine of any church.
Let’s examine FAIR and immigration, since that is the basic outlook of so many liberals and ‘others’.
It seems that most people who are in favor of open borders believe that it basically isn’t fair that people from Mexico, Central America and South America don’t have the same opprotunities that citizens of the US have.
I have a question to those who feel this way. If you let everyone from those areas enter the US so they can improve their lives, is it fair that people in places like Afria and Southeast Asia weren’t born in a country from which they can essentially walk to the US? Shouldn’t we be providing ships and aircraft to people from around the world who want to come here to better themselves? Wouldn’t that be fair?
And then, what happens when we are fair to every potential immigrant who wants to come here and our population increases to a billion? Where do they stay? What do they eat?
Eric, are you ready to open up your home, closets, car and refrigator to two additional families? (I’ll just assume that silence means no and that you’d rather maintain your lifestyle and not be FAIR).
#168 Faster
You’re right to a certain degree, but that doesn’t completely explain why almost every diocese and faction of the Catholic Church has adopted Mahoney’s position.
Trl3
Not going there, way too many instances think about it
But it was just a blanket statement like I think Nicolas Corbett accidentally shot the guy in AZ and is on trial for his life - I think it was an accident read about it he was shocked devasted, upset, tried to give aid
Thats someone who deserves the benefit of a doubt not to be tried for murder
But remember that Eric doesn’t live here so he can preach but not be made to practice.
America must be the only country that actually rewards fraud. Breaking into the US for the sole purpose of having an American Citizen baby is fraud, and it disappoints me that people who are “under the jurisdiction” of a foreign country, bear children that are US citizens when clearly they only qualify for one of the two requirements for citizenship. Our supreme court should right this wrong. Unfortunately, with people like JORGE BUSH in charge, we will continue to go down this crazy path. But, since her son has been classified a US citizen, he should leave with her and then he can come back when he is 18 and self sufficient.
If I had a hospital in ElPaso, or any other border state, I would build a bridge to the other side, and just wheel pregnant women across the brige to the Mexican side of the hospital. Or maybe we could CEDE 1000 sq ft of every hospital to Mexico, so they could be born on their own soil! It’s all just a big joke, and the joke’s on us. And if they are born on the street there is no proof they were born here, no proof no citizenship. If I sound bitter, well I am. This situation is out of control.
Millions and millions of people live and work in their own countries, and they do just fine. I think that illegal aliens are cowards and traitors. Why would anyone want to welcome cowards and traitors, let alone criminals? They should have the courage to stay and change their own country, instead of cutting and running. 12 million people could surely overthrow the Mexican government! This woman should go home and protest the treatment of her fellow citizens there. But she’s a coward, and will only protest here where she does not have to be accountable for her actions or her opinions. why did she leave her son behind? Because she’ll be back a week after she’s deported.
Peter
Anyone would be crazy fiscally to open a factory in America that requires physical labor
Sorry I wish it weren’t true thats why I push education cause those 35 dollar a hr broom pushing forklift driving jobs are heading south and east far east that is
Perfect example of you basing your argument on a false premise. You have no proof to back that statement up, consequently your argument falls flat.
Faster, Pope John Paul II was vigorous in his purging of the clergy of liberation theology-minded priests. Guess who his point man was? Cardinal Ratzinger, now Pope Benedict XVI.
DCGirl I worked for one of those international but boutique engineering firms 3 Holidays Thanksgiving (not the Friday) Xmas and New Years work day was when the work was finished, no sick leave, no paid vacation.
Great pay, great opportunities, when my first kid was born they furnished the baby room, the two owners rewarded hard work and worked with you
Hard work isn’t for everyone I also went to school at night and completed another college degree as well
So when people tell me they won’t work for 25 dollars an hour I got people who will for 15 and be glad for it
Eric, I’m not sure that I’m grasping your message there.
America has plenty of labor for driving forklifts and pushing brooms; unfortunately, our government has made the dicision to pay a large portion of them to sit at home and watch Jerry Springer.
Nite all thanks for your conversation
#175 Hamous
IT’S NOT EVEN A PREMISE!!!
Answer this question: what other reasons would the Catholic Church have for supporting illegal immigration?
ICE left her son behind - she’ll be back. Why are we breaking up families? The kids should go too. Any illegal family member commits a crime - THE ENTIRE FAMILY GETS DEPORTED! WHAT IS WRONG WITH BEING TOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
MAXINE GETS IT RIGHT!
Everyone concentrates on the problems we’re having in this country lately; illegal immigration, hurricane recovery, alligators attacking people in Florida. Not me. I concentrate on solutions for the problems. It’s a win-win situation.
+ Dig a moat the length of the Mexican border.
+ Send the dirt to New Orleans to raise the level of the levies.
+ Put the Florida alligators in the moat along the Mexican border.
Any other problems you would like for me to solve today?
Here’s one of the biggest social justice “Christian” groups. Read their message and read between the lines. They are commies dressed as apostles. Read their columns and the posts. They sound like KosKids more than Christians.
http://www.sojo.net/index.cfm?action=about_us.mission
The liberation theology crowd is real popular south of the border. Especially in Central America. The Catholic Church is dominant down there. Not that the Catholic Church is communist or anything!!! It’s an opinion of mine that those that deal with illegals (not hiding them but in outreach ministries) may have their opinions warped. This theology was involved with the communists in Central America in the 1980’s. Some forget that JEsus did not get involved in politics. He was crucified because they thought he would be! He was here for a GREATER purpose!
” Writing in the November 1983 issue of Sojourners, ministry leaders Jim Wallis and Jim Rice drafted what would become the charter of leftist activists committed to the proliferation of Communist revolutions in Central America. Titled “Promise of Resistance,” this document called on activists to carry out various acts of civil disobedience in order to obstruct any attempt by the United States to invade Nicaragua. CISPES, the propaganda arm of El Salvador’s Marxist guerrilla movement, was invited by Sojourners to participate in acts of resistance in the event of American military intervention. Nearly 70,000 activists signed the document, which was sent to Congress, President Reagan, the Defense Department, and the CIA.”
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/groupProfile.asp?grpid=7018
Another good Maxine’ism’ is that since we have a problem with demand raising the price of gas, if we deport all the illegals, the demand in the US will go down and so will the price!
For those of you who haven’t seen the vido immigration gumballs… it’s a quick watch and very informative
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7WJeqxuOfQ
AW (#160) - You’re right about money sent to Mexico from the US:
“US demand for Mexican labor in 2006 helped fuel nearly US$25 billion in remittances that were sent back to Mexico from workers in the US. At nearly 3% of GDP, remittance flows outstripped both foreign direct investment and tourism revenues last year.”
http://www.morganstanley.com/views/gef/archive/2007/20070619-Tue.html
That’s $25 billion the illegals didn’t spend in the US; or about $2.06 BILLION in unpaid sales taxes at 8.25%.
There’s a “are you still beating your wife” question if I ever heard one…
I hope this link works. Check the debate going on on the leftist Christian view of this. Like I said, Kos Kids for Jesus….
A typical post:
“Clearly a political arrest and deportation to pacify the talk radio callers and the like I call the “immophobes” …”
Posted by: Larry Parker | August 20, 2007 11:42 AM
http://blog.beliefnet.com/godspolitics/2007/08/sanctuary-movement-activist-ar.html#comments
#171 Bannable
Claims to many instances to think about but can not name a single one.
In Texas we have a name for people like you. It has 4 letters, begins with a L ends with an R and has an IA in the middle. Using it usually gets a “DELETED” even though it is true.
#186 jimb
I’m not saying there aren’t other reasons, in fact, I know several (Church doctrine-related).
However, let’s look at this from a realistic standpoint. The Catholic Church is a big business. It has suffered immense financial losses and losses in membership (or perhaps support is a better word) in many areas of the country.
Does it not make sense for the Church to court illegals when a great percentage of them are Catholic or could become Catholic?
C’mon, it’s just common sense.
Anyway, I want to hear what other valid reasons there are other than the obvious ones stated by the Church’s “official policy”.
That’s all.
There’s a flaw in your premise that has been pointed out already:
People can be contributing Catholics just about anywhere in the world, certainly in Mexico.
Shakey, you presuppose that it is a settled matter that the Catholic Church supports illegal immigration as a matter of policy, hence the “are you still beating your wife” tone to your premise. I’m not sure that it does.
#191 jimb
There’s a flaw in your premise also.
The Catholic Church in the United States is a big business that is coming off a major scandal that caused huge financial losses and losses in member support.
What part of that don’t you get?
#192 jimb
Look it up. You’re wrong.
The church is God’s church. Catholic or Protestant. It will survive whatever we try and do to it.
God doesn’t care about our politics near as much as we do.
#195 - Amen to that!
/Uh oh. I wonder if that’s too preachy?
#195 Faster I am so glad you said that. I am trying to stay out of this and you just said this so well.
Bannable Lecturer Says:
“Yep thats right her only crime was to come here and work”
Sir, I am a Federal Agent of 35 years.
You are wrong.
She was CONVICTED of SS Fraud. That’s a felony.
I remember her case. She was let off of the IRS Tax Code charge because of the leniency that was practiced at that time. They figured that Deportation was bad enough.
I brought Tax Fraud up for a reason, see below.
“There is a BIG Difference between stealing an indentity and submitting a false SS#
Call the police and ask em”
Ok, I’m here.
If you write down another person’s SS# and stick it in a drawer, that’s no crime.
If you “find” another person’s SS card and stick it in a drawer, that’s no crime. The SS Regulations require you to contact the SS office if you find one, but it’s not a crime if you don’t. However, it can be used as evidence against you in cases where it is relative to the crime you are being investigated for.
Purchasing a fake or stolen SS IS a Felony.
SUBMITTING a SS to an Employer for employment verification is SS fraud (crime against SSA) AND ID theft (crime against against an individual, alive or dead).
When the Employer submits tax forms to the IRS based on that SS#, it is now Tax Fraud.
So, you see, even though Elvira was only convicted of SS fraud, all of the above was actually committed. Altogether, if this happened with todays laws, could have gotten her 3-7 years in Federal Prison.
Now, I don’t know why you are defending Elvira here, and don’t really care, but how about getting your facts straight before you post something as gospel. You do yourself and your cause a disservice by not doing so.
Bannable, in characterizing my post as “emotional,” you somehow forgot to include all the facts I included to support my position.
Those facts included crime rate citations, studies on corruption in various countries and the like.
I’m sure it’s an innocent oversight that will be corrected swiftly.
There’s s fine line between witnessing to people (illegal or not) and courting illegal aliens.
The Catholic Church many times gets accused of doing something they are, in fact, NOT doing. Especially in this situation. Many Hispanics are Catholic and I’m sure there are many illegals going to church. Many go to Baptist churches, Methodist, etc… Ministering to people and breaking the law are not the same. When the church does an outreach, they are trying to introduce those ‘unchurched’ to the gospel. Now, can the lines sometimes get blurred? Of course, it happens all the time. Our beliefs and God’s should be the same, but we see with the flesh and not the spirit. If this woman were in danger should she go home, she ought to stay here. She is not, she is led by her greed, to make more money and get more stuff here than she could get at home. So, is it unChristian to send her packing? No. She should follow the law, Jesus did. It is unChristian to violate the law on her behalf? Any church that harbors, or encourages law breaking is not acting as God would have them. Jesus paid his taxes and followed the law. Paul followed the law, all the way to his own execution.
The Catholic church has been accused of many things, but more people have been saved from hell in the Catholic church, by the word preached there, than any other. Give it up where it is due! The church is made up of people. People who realize that they are not perfect, but serve one who is. IMHO.
He’s asleep boys. It’s late in Doha.
Matt,
He’s relying on Mexico actually reporting crime correctly. How many crimes in Mexico actually get reported?
Robo Tech
Dannable don’t need no stinkin facts. He says whatever he wants whenever he wants and you must be one despicable person to dare disagree with him.
Yeah, he has plants to move to the far east. And tomorrow comes way too soon!
http://files.turbosquid.com/Preview/Content_on_3_21_2005_08_56_49/plants.jpgde99edbe-1032-496c-907d-1d0712744047Large.jpg
I scarcely know where to start.
It looks as though you’re claiming that motive=guilt. That’s a bit ridiculous, like claiming that people who like money are bank robbers.
And your motive isn’t even well-reasoned! You’re claiming that the worldwide Catholic Church wants to increase membership by moving people from a predominantly Catholic country to a country where churchgoing is a lot less common.
You’re making it sound as though the Pope sent out a memo:
I think it’s all just a game with bannable…… say something so outrageous it gets a rise in everyone and then off the comments go……..
While I was home for lunch I saw an interview with Father Jonathan Morris on FoxNews. He was asked about this case in particular and illegal immigration in general. His position was that if anyone, not just an illegal immigrant, came to his church and needed food or clothing he would never ask about their immigration status as a prerequisite to providing that food. But he said he would not provide sanctuary for someone knowingly violating the law, and he came down pretty hard on Archbishop Mahoney for advocating that others do.
Does the U.S. have a process where a person from Mexic, etc. can enter our country legally, be documented and receive some type of paperwork where they can work for X period of time, pay taxes and then return home when they are done??
Isn’t that a green card?
Tsk! Tsk! When are y’all gonna learn to quit letting EPJ jerk your chain? No matter WHAT, you will NEVER change that Trolls mind. SHEESH! Another mark on his belt for you taking the bait, once AGAIN….Rumor has it, that he was smiling when he went to bed. Mission Accomplished!
ST I think you nailed it. But it was good reading.
bigjolly paid me to respond to him and drive up his comment count
Ohhhhhhhh so this is all Big Jolly’s fault LOL……next time he goes by that great BBQ joint where he dropped $28 on lunch……. he needs to bring some for us!!!
That is one thing that bigjolly would never, ever do, at least regarding one specific commenter.
AW, please don’t repeat that. Thus far, SU hasn’t found out.
Just don’t mention Ramos and Campean lol
I am posting this in every comment thread today, so no one can claim they didn’t see it.
Have a nice day.
—————–
Here’s what I know–
I have a job; a real job, where I am accountable to others. I must make money to achieve and maintain and posses they things I want in life (food, clothing, housing, health care, family that will have something to do with me, etc.)
Having to worry or even think much about what’s going on in comment threads on LST makes it harder for me to do my real job. And that is a “red line” for me.
That’s why I’ve “outsourced” comment moderation to other contributors–because they seem to like being involved, and that means I don’t have to.
Well, guess what. Some folks are tiring of the nonsense. The vaguely cloaked (or downright explicit) use of inappropriate language. The trolling and mind-games. The discussions of personalities and motives, not facts, or issues, or opinions about issues.
This has largely been an experiment in self-governance… and I deem it to have failed.
So here’s the new rule– I call it the “Pain in Benzion’s Ass Rule” and it is real simple:
If what you are writing or doing in comments on LST becomes a pain in my ass, it and you are gone. No warning. No explanation. No appeal. Doesn’t matter how long you’ve been here. Doesn’t matter if you’ve contributed to a Begathon. Gone, goodbye, over, forever.
Stop it. Now. Stop. It.
Focus on issues, not on each other. If you disagree with someone, engage with them respectfully. Use facts and logic. If you are feeling really bold, try spell-check and punctuation. If someone is being a jerk, ignore them.
The Sword of Righteousness has been unsheathed, and I am looking for an excuse to start swinging.
re: #213 I hope everyone knows I was kidding. I don’t even think bigjolly is part of “HE ET AL”.
#219: Hammie, c’mon…bigjolly paid…nuff said!/ducks and hauls butt!
Yet another group that excludes bigjolly. I have no friends, no supporters, no one cares about me, guess I’ll just eat worms.
Well, of course if you want to join HE ET AL you can. I don’t think there’s any ban on big jolly type fellows.
#221 BJ: If ya BBQ for me, I’ll be your friend and bring the sides! I’ll even do the dishes, so you or SU won’t have to!
If St brings the sides, I’ll bring home made banana pudding with bananas and vanilla wafers… I might dry dishes….. but that’s really pushing it.
All of a sudden everyone is talking about food instead of the topic. Did DB scare everyone off?
#225: Sorry dcgirl! Everything has been pretty much/and more/ discussed on this thread. I’m hungry.
Bottom line: Illegal is illegal. Elvira knew she could possibly be punished for her actions, and she did. I do have a feeling that she will be back. Maybe with another anchor baby?
Do I feel sorry for her? NO. Do I feel sorry for her child? Yes. He did not ask for this. Shame on his mama.
did = was….darn spell check didn’t catch that one!
How do you do spell check on this site, other than copying the post in Word and checking it before copying it back.
I suspect the lawyer who now has custody of the child had a lot to do with this as well.
That’s pretty much the bottom line, innit?
Bet everyone got hungry and went out for taco’s.
i have a real important question:
Jimb,
How is your daughter doing?
229 dcgirl
If you make to Mozilla Firefox your browser, it spell–checks even your blog postings.
If you are using Internet Explorer as your browser, I don’t know what the options are for spell check.
231 - she’s drivin’ me nuts!
Actually, she’s doing well - She still has multiple follow-ups lined up for the forseeable future, but things are looking good…
use google fer spel chek
testing the spell checker
Sorry, just playing with the google toolbar spell checker. Seems to work OK…
Jimb, bet it is great having her drive ya nuts. I’ll take nuts everyday with my Jared!
No matter what we debate here nothing is more serious then our kids.
#237 - amen to that…
Two things
This lady defrauded the American people by sneaking across the border and dropping anchor. The boy gets the boot too.
The Catholic church can kiss my butt! They have been a co-conspirator in this fraud.
This makes me angry.
OUT
Daniel, please understand the facts before you castigate the Catholic church.
Oh, and kicking the boy out is not the way it works. He is an American citizen.
I’d tell you to vote in the primary but I know that is pointless.
Unfortunately, whatever the intent behind the 14th amendment, it is written such that there’s little doubt that “anchor babies” are indeed US citizens. Shortsightedness on the part of those who wrote the 14th, I suppose…
To be perfectly honest with “the group”, I’m pretty ticked off that no one has recognized my title to this post for what it is. Err, what I meant for it to be.
Daniel, did you miss the part where it was the Methodist church that provided her sanctuary?
“This group” or “that group”?
I’m not sure. I might be bi-group. Which, in my case is the equivalent of no-group. Not fun to be the bigjolly.
BigJ do you have to pay money to the Oak Ridge Boys for using their tune?
You talkin’ about the Oak Ridge Boys reference??
I thought it went without saying…
Dallas Frazier
Note to self: Never tangle with Hamous when it comes to music trivia…
Jimb, you are absolutely right. I’ve been over to his blog and watched him on his music trivia stuff. He is the master, bar none! He is ripe for Who Wants to Be a Millionaire.
I need to do some more of those trivia questions. Only problem is, the woman who can keep up with me won’t play anymore. She’s good!
#252 Well I know fer sho’ it twern’t me! Those trivia games drive me bonkers.
It was Towandala.
Matt,
There is a huge crime rate in America, World statistics show that we are tolerant of it the World Crime statistics center showed that America has a multiple crime rate of that of Mexico, yours was an opinion paper showing transparency.
I agree that transparency is a much ballyhood topic and if Transparency in Business deals was the sole arbitator of a crime index then Qatar, CHina and france would be on death row.
But in Crimes and even crime victims the US far outstrips the central American countries - its a sad and sobering fact
I posted those facts today, and I have posted the crime rate stats here numerous times and BTW have posted those today on a national conservative blog and they have always been well accepted.
Did I hear an echo in here?
256
Hellooo Helloo Hello
Nope, just your imagination!
I thought I was imagining things. Whew.
(chirp)
This Elvira was always good for a laugh…
Ca Caww Ca Cawww Ca Cawwww
In my best “Evolution” Mall Scene Ca Cawww
jimb, a laugh? I was in love. Er, sorta, ya know what I mean?
Okay a few things I’ve experienced. I was married to a Mexican-American with very close ties with Mexico. In fact I’ve known many Mexican American’s and although I hate painting with a broad brush many of them are only marginally moral. Many will put up a front of being church going, but will molest daughters, sons, cousins etc. As well as break other laws without batting an eyelash. To some degree our crime rate can be attributable to “Hispanics gone wild” They can’t or won’t commit crimes in their mother country because that is a good fast way to end up either shot or dead. Where as here we go out of our way to provide the accused with 3 squares, a bunk, a roof over their head and, free legal council.
DELETED FOR LANGUAGE AND RACIST REMARKS
I believe that the law on Anchor babies need to be clarified so that only lawful arrivals to this country are eligible and only through a very lengthy and extensive examination process. If you break our laws and sneak in to our country you and you progeny should not be rewarded for bad behavior. Most Hispanics who are here illegally, want the easy way out. It was far easier to come north than to stick it out and go through the generational processes of fixing up their own country. Secondly they want us Americans to capitulate to them and give then everything without haven to work hard and bleed for it.
Quote: “AZ Says:
August 20th, 2007 at 7:01 am
Snip…
So why doesn’t the Feds. shut them down, or at least strip them of their non-profit benefits?”
I would say that it is because they are criminals and also aiding and abetting this illegal invasion.
This is another part of our immigration laws. You know how the criminals in our government defy their oaths of office and say illegal immigration is Federal matter? Imagine them over looking the rules about bank robbery or kidnapping. They are also Federal crimes.
TITLE 8 > CHAPTER 12 > SUBCHAPTER II > Part VIII > § 1324
Snip…
(c) Authority to arrest
No officer or person shall have authority to make any arrests for a violation of any provision of this section except officers and employees of the Service designated by the Attorney General, either individually or as a member of a class, and all other officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws.
and all other officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws.
and all other officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws.