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43 Responses to “The Holocaust Declaration”
  1. Fasternu 426 on April 11th, 2008 at 8:11 am

    Done! Now I must sleep…

  2. sargevining on April 11th, 2008 at 8:12 am

    None of this is true. It;s all a trcik by Bush/McCain to get us into the wat with Iran that they’ve been trying to get us into for the past 6 years. Thank God we’ve been successful in stopping them so far—don’t let yourself be tricked now.

    Even if a nuke does go off in Isreal, that will only be proof of the lengths to which the neocons will go to in order to widen the war.

    /do I need the sarc tag?

  3. sargevining on April 11th, 2008 at 8:18 am

    Anyone who thinks that the above comment is off the mark, read some of the comments here:

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article3724048.ece

    In a story that has an ACTUAL satellite photograph of Iran’s long range missle launching facility, we get this:

    I think it fair to say we are seeing another attempt by neo cons in the USA do their best to take us to another false war. I am certain that if push came to shove and Iran and Israel faced each other in a show down, both would disarm. If its ok for Israel to have nukes is it not ok for Iran to have nukes. If as Iran says their nuke program is for peaceful purposes., then we have nothing to worry about. If not then Israel has some things to worry about, but they already have the weapons pointed armed itching at the bit to let them fly to wards Tehran. However I can no longer believe a word from any US Official on these issues. least of all Bush and Co. Lets hope that the time left of the Neo Cons passes by quickly and without to many more wars or false flag operations. The world is sick and tied of their lies and spin on the truth. They have no moral or credibility left anymore with me.

  4. Bonecrusher on April 11th, 2008 at 8:21 am

    Mr. Krauthammer is absolutely correct as usual. It would be the supreme act of irresponsibility for the USA to refrain from destroying the centrifuge facilities - WORLD OPINION/PC CRAP BE DAMNED! We can absolutely trust that once the mullahs/ahmajackass get nukes, they will threaten their ARAB neighbors and bomb Israel. The time to control the rabid dog is before it bites someone, before the damage is done. Let’s lance this boil on humanity and start healing.

  5. marksolot on April 11th, 2008 at 9:11 am

    Here is one simple undispuyable fact

    If Israel’s enemies disarm then absolutely nothing happens…Hubcaps rust.

    If Israel disarms then there will be millions of dead Jews within days/weeks.

  6. Dov on April 11th, 2008 at 9:14 am

    My Opinion

    The US is not going to destroy Irans nuke facilities. I “think” Iran is going to attempt to Nuke Israel. Israel has the capabilities to take Irans “attempt” out of the air.

    The world will have seen that allahdinnerjacket sent the first “armed” assault and Israel was protecting itself. Israel will than flex her muscles and show the arabs what Israel is capable of. Israel will not “Nuke” Iran but a greater portion of Tehran will disappear.

  7. Maltboy! on April 11th, 2008 at 9:18 am

    We’ve been Krauthammer-ed back into reality once again! Unfortunately, it will probably take a nuclear 9-11 to get our collective attention. I posted this link of Newt Gingrich talking about terrorism the other day, but I think it’s worth reposting in this thread.

    http://edition.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/08/08/gingrich/index.html#cnnSTCVideo

  8. Shannon on April 11th, 2008 at 9:33 am

    No Sarge, it will be an inside job by Bush, like 9/11.

  9. radiovixen on April 11th, 2008 at 9:39 am

    Isn’t this cause right up the ACLU’s alley?!

  10. NativeAmerican on April 11th, 2008 at 9:47 am

    For quite a while now, I’ve been of the opinion that a nuke will go off somewhere in or near the “cradle of civilization” sometime in the next small number of years. I also believe that it will be a muslim state’s weapon.

    Finally, the odds of it exploding in Israel or in one of the muslim countries are even.

  11. texpat on April 11th, 2008 at 10:07 am

    I support the call for this Declaration, but I have reservations about the effectiveness of it. My problem with the Krauthammer solution is it rests upon two pillars: the assumption we are actually dealing with rational actors and defensive, retaliatory action. I reject the first and find the second to be “a little action, a little too late”.

    What good does it do to tell the Iranian mullahs we will obliterate their country after they have murdered or mutilated the population of Israel, the Palestinians of Gaza and the West bank, killed untold Lebanese, Jordanians and even Syrians ? It is 68 miles from Tel Aviv to Amman, Jordan and only 88 miles lie between Haifa and Damascus. A nuclear attack would not only utterly destroy Israel, it would render a large area of Islamic lands uninhabitable. The horror of an attack like this is incomprehensible and I think the geopolitical repercussions are not what most people think they would be. For instance, the first phone call to the White House would come from the Saudis demanding we remove Iran from the map. Personally, I advocate proactive and aggressive measures to prevent even the possibility of any attack and let the Devil take the hindmost.

  12. duhmoose on April 11th, 2008 at 10:12 am

    Dov, How many times has Israel defended itself from attacks by Muslim groups, only to be labeled the “aggressor” by the UN and Arab sympathizers?

  13. Dov on April 11th, 2008 at 10:25 am

    # 12

    Far too many. However when Iran actually tries to Nuke Israel the world will step back and take note. Even the Islamic states are going to have to understand that Iran pulled the plug, Israel flushed em.

    Alladinnerjacket wants to start the end of the world and a lot of us aren’t ready to go.

  14. David Benzion on April 11th, 2008 at 10:28 am

    texpat– I believe part of the goal is to pressure/encourage the rational actors in Iran (and they do exist, within certain segments of society) to finally grab control of the steering wheel from the loonies that are currently in charge.

  15. David Benzion on April 11th, 2008 at 10:28 am

    Not a great situation to be in, however you slice it.

  16. Bonecrusher on April 11th, 2008 at 10:40 am

    Further to #14; Benzion is correct in that there are reasonable Persians in Iran. In fact, ahmanutjob is sitting on a powder keg as we speak - the majority in Iran are sick of the mullahs and their tyranny. I learned this info in a meeting with a retired Iranian airforce colonel. This man was exiled when the Shah fell. All it is going to take is a good shove and the Iranian house o cards will fall. I asked the colonel if the general people were prepared to do what it takes (understand slaughter) in reference to the mullahs and thier ilk and he said yes, absolutely.
    We are living in very interesting times real history is happening before our eyes and we all should commit our understanding to paper for posterity and not let the lunatic moonbat lefty fringe spin it the wrong way.

  17. Bonecrusher on April 11th, 2008 at 10:43 am

    #15 David; Shalom and happy preparation day. As bad as it may be we still win in the end.

  18. texpat on April 11th, 2008 at 10:45 am

    #14 David

    I understand that and know there are plenty of rational, and pro-American people, in Iran. I just don’t want it to be acceptable that mullahs “who are slightly less crazy” can be in control while leaving that back door open for the nutjobs to seize power again. I believe the theocratic thugacracy has to be overturned and relegated to a secure corner where they can be watched. I wish we had Bill Casey and James Jesus Angleton around to overthrow the SOBs from within. They could organize a coup in a couple of weeks and I seriously doubt we have anyone who knows how to do that anymore.

  19. texpat on April 11th, 2008 at 10:48 am

    #16 Bonecrusher

    We are living in very interesting times real history is happening before our eyes and we all should commit our understanding to paper for posterity and not let the lunatic moonbat lefty fringe spin it the wrong way.

    I would hope we are making a contribution to that effort right here on LST.

  20. raiderdav on April 11th, 2008 at 10:50 am

    I agree with texpat, and even the HotAir post on this today (and I rarely side with Allahpundit over there).

    Redundant, it would be said, because Israel could retaliate on its own. The problem is that Israel is a very small country with a small nuclear arsenal that is largely land-based.

    I think this underestimates the dominance of Israel’s arsenal in the region. Israel’s nuclear capabilities in comparison to the U.S. is small, but in comparison to Iran and others in the region, it is a serious force that shouldn’t be tested.
    I think you’re selling Israel a little short by thinking they even need the US to make a statement like Krauthammer is recommending. Israel’s military capabilities are only limited by political pressures - they can squash anyone in the area.

    A nuclear strike on pretty much ANY nation would be met with a response by the U.S. I don’t think Iran could get away with nuking itself without a swift response by our govt.

  21. texan1953 on April 11th, 2008 at 10:52 am

    As futile as it seems…we must contact those that represent us and make our concerns known. As far as Iran nuking Israel…the world would step back and be happy it wasn’t them. Iran has made their desires known by words, print and action…why does America and the rest of the world sleep?

  22. Bonecrusher on April 11th, 2008 at 10:52 am

    #19 Texpat; this is true but in later years the widsom espoused in this “cyber forum” may not be available. For security and ease of review, perhaps we should be journaling on paper. It is possible that in the not to distant future we may not be able to enjoy the net as we do today.

  23. texpat on April 11th, 2008 at 11:00 am

    #22 Bonecrusher

    Good grief ! That is a grim, foreboding prediction you infer. However, if America were to head down the dead-end road of censorship Canada is on right now, it could be true. Heaven forbid.

  24. texpat on April 11th, 2008 at 11:02 am

    LST archive CDs as prohibited samizdata sold in hushed whispers from beneath overcoats in dark alleys. Now I am depressed.

  25. Bonecrusher on April 11th, 2008 at 11:10 am

    #23 Even though I was never a Boy Scout, the motto still stands ‘be prepared’.

  26. bob42 on April 11th, 2008 at 11:39 am

    The chief danger of Internet regulation is the impact to the free market that it enables, and hungry congress critters that would love to tax internet commerce.

    As much as our government would like to regulate networked free speech too, I don’t think they can do so completely because the underlying technology, the Internet Protocol, does not care what kind of transport media it runs on. I know a few HAMs that have been doing IP over RF for years.

    This link is to an official IETF RFC that describes how the Internet Protocol can use carrier pigeons to send and receive IP datagrams.

  27. bob42 on April 11th, 2008 at 11:41 am

    (My apologies if HAL spits out a dupe of this comment in a few minutes. My first attempt lacked a link…)

    The chief danger of Internet regulation is the impact to the free market that it enables, and hungry congress critters that would love to tax internet commerce.

    As much as our government would like to regulate networked free speech too, I don’t think they can do so completely because the underlying technology, the Internet Protocol, does not care what kind of transport media it runs on. I know a few HAMs that have been doing IP over RF for years.

    This link is to an official IETF RFC that describes how the Internet Protocol can use carrier pigeons to send and receive IP datagrams.

  28. Shannon on April 11th, 2008 at 11:46 am

    Say what you will about Tony Cordesman, but this is an interesting piece.

    Iran, Israel and Nuclear War: An Illustrative Scenario Analysis

    http://www.csis.org/index.php?option=com_csis_pubs&task=view&id=4172

  29. David Benzion on April 11th, 2008 at 11:59 am

    I assume, btw, that everyone has called and emailed, right?

    I may start requiring proof before allowing more comments.

  30. luv2hammer on April 11th, 2008 at 12:00 pm

    Well if they nuke Isreal they can say good bye to Mecca,and Madinah. The Islamics that are left will no longer have to worry about which way is east, they will be able to see the glow.

  31. T-Hawkk on April 11th, 2008 at 12:00 pm

    If Iran wants nuclear weapons, I say let’s give them some - and show them how we set them off, right over Teheran!

    Teheran - Terror Iran?

  32. luv2hammer on April 11th, 2008 at 12:03 pm

    #20

    Do you really think Obama would respond in kind?

  33. raiderdav on April 11th, 2008 at 12:16 pm

    #32 I don’t think Obama would have a choice, but I’d much rather he wasn’t in a position to have the authority. Either way, I doubt his decisions would be any different regardless of any declarations we make now. What Krauthammer is talking about here isn’t some sort of binding contract that all future presidents would have to abide by.

  34. raiderdav on April 11th, 2008 at 12:34 pm

    #29 Proof:

    Thank you for contacting my offices. Your correspondence has been received, and we will respond to you as quickly as possible. A copy of your message is attached below for your records.

  35. Ree-C Murphey on April 11th, 2008 at 12:56 pm

    Krauthammer’s call to action is articulate, inspiring and will not be heeded.

    Unfortunately, Pres Bush has spent his Political Capital, and he is no longer believed. The lefties don’t believe him when he proclaims “the sky is blue”, let alone that “Iran is a menace”. Those of us on the Right are having a hard time listening to him because of his failure to act quicker in Iraq or the Border.

    So here we are; facing a real threat and no one believes or wants to believe the boy yelling “threat”.

    We, as a nation are tired of fighting; what we don’t understand is that our enemies are not.

    This war has been so politicized by the left, that no one will believe “Bushco” and/or a “Neocon”. (See comment #3 above.)

    What they fail to understand is that Bush didn’t start this; if anyone is to be blamed, blame Jimmy Carter. Carter was the one that threw out the Shah of Iran and the Ayatollah Khomeini took over.

    From the moment that “Revolution” took hold, the dream of its followers were to get a nuclear bomb and drop it on Israel first and foremost, then us. How do I know? See this article
    I wrote almost 2 years ago
    .

    What will it take to get our government to move to action and our people to realize it is the right thing to do?

    Answer: A mushroom cloud over Israel and New York (and possibly more cities).

    Short of that, nothing will be done to prevent this catastrophe in the making.

    (If I were Israeli, I would be sending my under-18 children to live abroad with relatives, especially if Obama wins the Presidency.)

  36. american woman on April 11th, 2008 at 2:01 pm

    #29 Done, and let me know other things we can do. I don’t think I have much pull with Kay Bailey since I told her I would never vote for her again, and promised to work against her getting elected to any office in the USA…. but it’s worth a try! :)

  37. american woman on April 11th, 2008 at 2:10 pm

    Here ya go…. proof

    On behalf of President Bush, thank you for your correspondence.

    We appreciate hearing your views and welcome your suggestions.

  38. texpat on April 11th, 2008 at 2:26 pm

    #29 Benzion

    I also took a shortcut to a better course. I e-mailed Fred Kagan at American Enterprise Institute and asked him to prevail on Bush. Fred is, after all, the one who wrote the blueprint for the Surge and convinced the WH to do it. I figure by now the Oval Office returns Fred’s calls.

  39. american woman on April 11th, 2008 at 2:35 pm

    #38 I just followed Texpat’s course. Anything else we can do?

  40. sargevining on April 11th, 2008 at 6:37 pm

    texpat Says:
    April 11th, 2008 at 2:26 pm
    #29 Benzion

    I also took a shortcut to a better course. I e-mailed Fred Kagan at American Enterprise Institute and asked him to prevail on Bush. Fred is, after all, the one who wrote the blueprint for the Surge and convinced the WH to do it. I figure by now the Oval Office returns Fred’s calls.

    Dr. David Kilcullen might be asking for an apology from you soon.

    And about a half dozen Colonels as well.

    Kagan was on board, but you give him too much credit.

  41. sargevining on April 11th, 2008 at 6:39 pm

    Here ya go pat:

    http://smallwarsjournal.com/blog/2008/04/kilcullen-redux-1/

    Kilcullen refresher course.

  42. texpat on April 11th, 2008 at 7:35 pm

    #40 Sarge

    What do a bunch of bench-warming REMFs and Kilcullen know ? They’re just trying to steal the limelight from Freddy Kagan.

    Ahem, I’m just kidding.

    Kagan wrote the conservative report, Choosing Victory: A Plan for Success in Iraq, for the AEI to refute the failings and omissions of the Iraq Study Group findings. He was invited to the WH for discussions with the President and is said to have been very influential in convincing him to adopt the strategies and tactics Petraeus has implemented so well.

  43. sargevining on April 11th, 2008 at 8:04 pm

    Correct—

    BUT

    He made that presentation in 2006.

    He got most of his ideas from Kilcullen, who first wrote about them in 2004:

    http://smallwarsjournal.com/documents/kilcullen.pdf

    Kilcullen’s, and most of the stuff written by the military egghead REMFS at SWJ is what informed my opinions and comments regarding Iraq and the COIBN tactics that would win this thing all through 2005 and 2006 when the “great minds” of the world were saying that we either needed to bombe thier cities to dust or get the hell out of Dodge.

    Events have proven the Kilcullens and Kagans of the world right and the latter day Jengis Khans (to borrow a phrase from another Famous (ahem) Military Man) wrong.

    Memeory does not serve me at the moment, but the guy who may have had the greatest impact was the one who thought up bring anthropologists on board to study the “human terrain,” a concept that has had more to do with the success we’re seing today than anything else.

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